Mafia vs Village GUZMAfia - Game Over, Team Skull Wins!

zorbees

Chwa for no reason!
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
honestly im pretty surprised the mafia killed me n1 when they knew my role which imo was fairly useless, i guess they really wanted the mole roles to work but still seems like a waste to me
 

Yeti

dark saturday
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
POSTGAME

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lEcNQ96CtFb3CyIOdhjXWGOxKGJpX9FBHs0ifeJVGUg/edit?usp=sharing
sheet

I came up with this game on the same line as MAGMAfia. The GUZMAfia. I wanted to do a Pokemon-themed game as well as experiment with how to make a closed theme ‘work’ without being extremely obvious who the mafia are.

Obviously they have to be given safeclaims by the host, but what can you do beyond that? What do you do with the titular Guzma in a GUZMAfia where Guzma’s Bois are the village?

I think a different host would have put Guzma as a neutral or some sort of lynchpin. The idea that Guzma was holding the Aether Foundation and Ultra Beasts together and his death, while harmful to the village, would split them, is an interesting one. Or not put him in the game at all, or put several different Guzmas in the game (beyond just Twin and von’s mole PM). There are a lot of avenues you can go down.

I originally did have the AF and UB as separate teams. I designed this as a smaller game, almost half the size it ended up being, and I felt 3-man mafias were a bit eh. So I made them one 6-man mafia. As more people kept joining, I kept them as one team and increased their numbers to 10. I pretty much did 2 villagers for every 1 mafia. Which, for an OC, I think is a pretty reasonable ratio for either team to win. Especially when there is no potential crossfire from two separate mafia teams.

This led to me knowing the mafia needed a second kill in order to remain competitive. I gave it to Buzzwole and then sort of absentmindedly gave that slot a bus driver as well. I also put a third 2x kill (rip Asek’s fakeclaim) onto the mafia, however, it needed to have information to work. I felt this was a reasonable limitation for an extra-extra kill.

Unfortunately I think too much power was loaded into Asek’s one role. The village had almost no defense against omniguarding Asek and bus driving the kill targets, except the Golisopod role which would act as Priority 1 and outspeed the bus drive. And if the mafia had killed Wimpod and he rogued right, they’d get a second First Impression BG.

This game was easier to do role names for when it was smaller, obviously. I had to dig Deep into the possible Skull paraphernalia trove to get some of the role names like Bike and Ultra Ball, especially because I had to provide 10 safeclaims to the mafia. So the actual village had to get some janky af role names. Every role name was in the Sun Moon games or anime.

Players/Roles:

Thetwinmasters / Guzma / BPV + Mayor

“Obviously” Guzma had to be in the game. This slot originally got randed to von, but I switched him and Twin as the latter requested village. I think the abilities are self-explanatory, Guzma as the boss of Team Skull has a second vote and takes an extra night to kill. But, if Guzma claims Guzma and so does Lusamine, and Lusamine gets inspected, it’s quite possible Guzma gets lynched, which his BPV doesn’t prevent. So he was vulnerable to a favorable inspection.

Twin claimed Guzma early on and was bamboozled by like 3 other Guzma claims. Von maintained he was Guzma throughout but the others backed down/got lynched. It did him no favors Haruno claimed his role PM said Guzma wasn’t town or whatever the flip he said, and cardflip was turned off so said PM was never seen. Twin was gutread as town by a couple other villagers due to his actions which helped him out, but Sam never fully trusted him. I think Twin did about what could be expected when he had a mole role designed to counterclaim him, doing so. He kept trying to lynch von but nobody would go for it. RIP.

MoodyCloud / Golisopod / First Impression Bodyguard

I had originally planned on Golisopod being Guzma’s twin and the Lusamine/Nihilego roles both appearing as Guzma/Golisopod respectively to mole Super Hardcore. But, I felt the mafia might not want to tie the two together and that both Guzma and Golisopod were already pretty darn good role name claims in their own right, the village didn’t need any kind of twin or mason group. This bodyguard worked by choosing one night to First Impression, which would be the Priority 1 move in the game and act before anything else. The next night, the bodyguard would only protect against the Aether Foundation-flavor kill, not the Buzzwole or Celesteela extra kills. And so on.

I’m not sure if Moody forgot to specify when he wanted to activate FI or Walrein/other leaders just never told him to, because FI was never used. Maybe once. The role obviously can’t self-protect. FI BG would have saved Walrein from his second bus drivering to death but for some bizarre reason Walrein just didn’t trust Moody enough and switched to using Adventure Kidnap as protection. FailFish. I personally feel like the skepticism around Moody was greatly unfounded. I tend to do non-standard BGs so I don’t know if the nature of FI + the weaker alternate night was misunderstood or if nobody really thought that MAYBE the Wimpod rogue would revive as this Golisopod role. Moody played fine for how he was never trusted. Just disappointing this role didn’t have more of an impact because it was so distrusted.

Blazade / Ariados / Priority-Lowering Safeguard

I continue my trend of non-standard guards with this SG. Anyone who tried to target the SGed user would have their priority lowered the next night. I personally thought this was some cool Sticky Web kinda deal that made a lot of ingame sense but the cucks playing my game didn’t have expanded enough intellects to comprehend this role. SMH. I wouldn’t necessarily recommend anyone repeat this role because even though I had a column to indicate the lowered priority I would always forget about it.

Blazade got completely dicked over by the mafia choosing Ariados to be their fake results shenanigans. And nobody on the village questioning why, in a 1v1, Blazade claims Ariados willingly on D1, denies the sketchy Ariados visitation flavor that makes people post their role names that was pretty clearly either him as town or some mafia BS, and maintains his role is a SG. Like how does this make any sense, he would just pick a different fakeclaim if he WAS mafia or claim the Ariados post restrictor. Whatever. Buffoon town as always. This had the fortunate consequence for the mafia of getting Blazade revealed very early, allowing them to martyr him onto Ditto almost every night so he couldn’t ever protect anyone on the village. Very good use of the mafia role due to Hitmonleet going public. If the mafia hadn’t chosen Blazade to pubreveal on the lynch of I honestly wonder if he would’ve been mislynched or misvigged before being checked, the village was that continually suspicious of him. SMH.

LightWolf / Plumeria / Cardflip Backup

I didn’t consider when I put Plumeria in that with the wtf 2 Guzma shenanigans, she would be the ideal role to claim and lead. A few villagers called for Plumeria to claim after the Haruno/4 Guzma noise happened. This role could control cardflip being ON or OFF. On, the game proceeded as normal. Off, this role would absorb a 1x use of each non-limited use dead role. It wouldn’t know what team its role came from, though. This role would absorb the vote doubler, for example, but not the Celesteela 2x kill or the 1x revive. Obviously collecting uses of dead roles, especially the more powerful mafia roles, would have huge advantages, but if you are having contested lynches or information IE Pidge’s attempt to sabotage, it would also be very disadvantageous.

This role being OFF pissed people off, especially before they knew who or what was doing it. A lot of speculation went around such as the revive’s use turned cardflip back on. LightWolf stayed a bit quieter throughout than I would’ve hoped. He did turn cardflip back on for the vital role. I think this role further sabotaged Asek’s 2x vig claim that pierced janitor. A cardflip control role made a janitor completely useless - if they were on separate teams (which once LW claimed town, you’d expect) the janitor could be shut down by having cardflip off. In light of this role, the janitor thing was just a bad call. I think a role of this nature has some good risk/reward in an OC and other hosts should consider using it. There are clear benefits to having it both ON (legit info) and OFF (backupped roles).

Fort Colorcastle / Breakdancing Grunt / Hooker

Standard hooker because the village needs some way to try and stop mafia actions. Kek.

This role didn’t do much for most of the game until it made the crucial hook onto Ditto, stopping him from martyring Blazade ONCE AGAIN and stopping Ditto from killing Fort himself. Fort had some activity problems so this slot idled twice. He also annoyed some of his fellow villagers by refusing to vote with them. I get his sentiment that they should be careful who they were voting since it was clearly a critical lynch, but like, looking at the two wagons it was very clearly 1 team against 1 other team trying to save acidphoenix, so I think there was no reason to consider not voting acidphoenix. Like, it wasn’t that “a couple villagers” thought UncleSam was a mole, the numbers made it very clear it was one full team against the other. Ultimately Fort voted right and let his team creep along to a victory. Good chap.

Shubaka17 / Po Town Pokemon Center Grunt / Killer Learner + 1x Reviver

I don’t quite remember why I put a revive onto the village except it seemed Dank. I think this role was originally just the revive but I felt that would be pretty boring, so I gave it a very weak info role. The info role never hit, of course. If shubaka’s target had died, he would have learned who killed his target. Again, this was not a good info role. But it was a nightly action. Most of this slot’s strength was the revive. The revive was supposed to be night-only in my head but I said “any time” in the PM so shubaka got the day revive onto Walrein which stalled the mafia’s ability to get majority.

Shubaka was more active in this game than he is in NOCs so props. He made the good call to revive Walrein when he did as the mafia knew who he was IIRC and were going to hook or kill him before he could use the revive. They got bamboozled by it working during the day. A very good use of the role though Walrein let himself die again right after.

Lord Gaius / Zubat Grunt / Mislynch Vig

This role needed two charges for a shot and it gained one charge for every mislynched villager. Considering how many villagers/rogues get mislynched in storied Smogon Dot Com mafia games, I figured it would give them a fighting chance. I divided the vig shots between mislynches and nightkills which could have disadvantages for the village if the deaths were split between 1/2 lynch and 3/4 kill and they had 0 shots but really needed 1.This role was a glorified vanilla for most of the game, though, especially once the village gets itself together. Sorry.

LG was townread by Walrein super early who has maybe finally learned some meta?!?!?!?!?! And deduced the charge vig is a staple of mine. Walrein played himself completely by not sheeting LG before he died. The revive gave him a chance to not be boneheaded and let Pidge get more mislynches in. LG further cleaned himself by killing off the first mafian to die, Flyhn, once he got the charges from Haruno and Acklow. He was active in the village leader Discord so overall well done.

Acklow / Yungoos Grunt / Vote Doubler

This role was another crappy, low-power role. It might’ve helped the village win a lynch lategame. It could also help the mafia out. But it was a night action so better than vanilla. And it was provable, I guess.

Acklow… decided this role was too lame for him and claimed Pokemon Trainer. Nobody should’ve believed this claim in the first place since I said the game was 1v1 and my distaste for neutrals is well known (hi Haruno). I don’t remember what his actual plan here was but he figured he could flesh something out, maybe, to help town. The mafia spent some time deliberating what this meant for their Pokemon safeclaims, though. Ultimately, Acklow made himself easy mislynch bait when Pidge came in claiming one of Acklow/AG was mafia. He also posted his role PM publicly because he cbf to read the rules, which was a precarious position because it would’ve greatly favored the mafia to godkill him and have AG get mislynched that same day, but the village also shouldn’t have gotten a free tip-off Acklow was Really Town due to that. Paperblade and others pointed this out, that how did Acklow even WRITE a fakeclaim with a team and host that knew you couldn’t c/p, but the sheeping too strong. I think it’s telling both the D1 and D2 mislynches were people who decided their plain town roles weren’t good enough and told some bs lies to people. Don’t act shady, people, or your team will lynch you.

Texas Cloverleaf / Salandit Grunt / Nightkill Vig

For every 4 villagers killed at night, this role got 1 shot. It only got 1 shot before the game ended and the mafia martyred it into their omniguard, so it did NOTHING. It also was a vanilla for most of the time as it gathered charges. This role was the counterpart to the Zubat Grunt and I think they play off each other pretty well as well as fitting into my game design meta. I think charge vigs let the village kill at a rate proportional to how badly they get dicked. If 4 of them die in the first 2 nights, they can strike back. If 4 of them die over 4 nights, they can’t slaughter the mafia at a 1 to 1 or 1 to 2 ratio of kills. This role and its counterpart also have huge roles in cardflip OFF meta where they can still be used to inform how many villagers died in any given cycle, even if they can’t say exactly which deaths were villagers.

Texas had some rl travels going on, so I think a role that had no action to send most nights was pretty good for him. He followed orders and always voted with his team so that’s really what you want to see from someone who is busy during the game or can’t otherwise get super involved. The mafia were very concerned about this role bashing them once their protective roles and hooker had died so their last-day plan was to fake persuade Twin to lynch Texas, before he got his next shot. A good plan, but a failed one.

UncleSam / Grunt A / Sane Cop (does not know sanity)

Another classic of mine are the cop ‘twins’ who often don’t know what their results mean! This time I split them up, Grunt A on the village and Grunt B as a mafia safeclaim, to allow that slot to act like this one’s twin and buddy up. UncleSam figured out pretty quickly he was sane though he and Pidge danced around contacting each other a bit despite both looking for the other. Even with cardflip off, Texas and LG’s roles could be used to help this one figure its sanity out.

Sam didn’t want to lead at first but both he and Pidge made attempts to reach out to the other Grunt, though it took a bit for them to actually connect. The mafia used this connection as their second shot of their info killer, but Snype had a Gut Feeling about Sam and sent him on the Adventure Kidnap, which gave him an extremely conveniently timed BPV. I think the mafia wins if Snype doesn’t kidnap Sam and he doesn’t get the BPV result. Sam was the one who took the most issue with Asek’s claim and decided to lynch him over AG, which again, the mafia won if this didn’t happen. He did overtrust Pidge, at least by Walrein’s estimates, but never actually sheeted him. The mafia would silence Sam but kept him alive, his role was pretty irrelevant once they all pubrevealed and his suspected scumteam was almost all of them anyway, so he led the village to victory (for once).

Steven Snype / Nest Ball / Adventure Kidnap

I wanted to do an adventure kidnap again though not as extensive as I had in whichever old SANDS game I first tested it. I figured one of the two ball role names would allot for that. This role would hook and bodyguard its target as well as render them unlynchable and with no vote for that day. So it had its uses to save a villager and to hook a mafia you didn’t necessarily want to lynch that day. The kidnapped user would send me a series of direction choices, 4 in total, and wherever they wound up was their result. Half of them were Nothing, you can see what each option led to plus Sam’s choices on the second tab on the main game sheet.

This role’s biggest impact was the aforementioned BPV to Sam. Without it, or if Sam had gotten Death or literally any other result, the mafia probably win. Snype idled this N0 but was suspicious of Sam because gut or something and used it on him N1. The mafia then killed Snype, I guess because they wanted this role out of the way before it could be turned on them. Walrein was using it sub-optimally to try and BG himself.

Aubisio / Female Grunt / Inspector

Nothing special to say here. Village needs info somehow.

The mafia got extremely unlucky they chose to persuade Aubisio which would have tied the lynch on the cycle Aubisio got grounded for. He sent in an action before not checking Smogon for 48 hours. If I hadn’t given Fort some grace regarding his idling I would have subbed him out for that day, but considering he did send a night action, this day WAS his grace period. And of course he came back an hour after deadline. I possibly should have subbed him anyway, or extended until he had a chance to vote. I don’t know. Aubisio contacted Sam after he cleaned him and then sent his orders each night, staying out of the spotlight. Pretty standard/solid inspector play.

Zorbees / Ultra Ball / Bamboozle Insurance

“Wtf does this role do lol” the refrain of everyone who encountered it. This was a role like one I’ve done before in ELECTRO iirc that can ‘fix’ the wonky info roles. In this case, if Aubisio inspected von while zorbees targeted Aubisio, he would have gotten the Lusamine PM, not the Guzma PM. He wouldn’t change the sanities of the two cops, but he would make them see through mole roles as well. So Sam would see Haruno as Good with zorbees’ role, and Bad without. I think this role could have been too destructive to the mafia’s ability to mole but they never really utilized their mole abilities or got inspected.

Zorbees randed Pidge N0 and then contacted him, giving Pidge a very easy in as Grunt B the cop. I agree that the mafia killing zorbees right after when he was in contact with Pidge and thus using his ability on Pidge was pretty sub-par. Yes this role was dangerous if Aubisio was targeted and Aubisio inspected von or jalmont but if zorbees was sticking on Pidge? There was no threat. I think zorbees claiming after N0 was a bit risky considering he had no clue what Pidge was but also pretty reasonable, and it got a mafia kill ‘wasted’ on a pretty docile role.

Paperblade / Wimpod / 3-Man Rogue

Rogue mislynch bait kek. This role could target three people and if one killed it, could revive. Let’s be real a single-target rogue unless factional is NEVER going to work and in a 1v1 that doesn’t make much sense, so I figured 3 targets would be plausible. This rogue could choose when it wanted to revive by posting in the thread and would return evolved into Golisopod, with the exact same FI BG role. I thought this made sense but apparently nobody else did so Moody was unfairly scumread, to the point Walrein died from not trusting him.

Paperblade was townread early by Walrein and cleaned in what Sam felt was an inefficient use of the inspect (to clean rather than to check the shadiest people). He did cool sheeted people stuff. His N0 rands were actually all mafia but his N1 was Bad. I think his role was exposed or leaked to the mafia at some point which of course makes a rogue extremely useless, because why would they kill him. I keep trying different rogues but they either get mislynched or exposed by idiot villages who think posting publicly X is a rogue and this is shady is a good idea because if X is a rogue, X is now vanilla and the mafia know not to ever kill that slot to hit BG/hooker/etc. Maybe I need to make a hookerogue combo or something.

Walrein / Confused Grunt / Guzmaker

This is a role that has absolutely no utility whatsoever in an open-themed game and wouldn’t even make sense but in a closed-theme game has all the desired dankness. If Guzma (Twin) died, this role could make another user Guzma, which added the last Guzma’s vote total onto the new Guzma’s (so Twin’s 2+new’s 1, then new’s 3+next’s 1 and so on). I knew the mafia could do some heavy damage killing villagers and also gain lynch majority somewhat quickly if the village mislynched which is almost a given at this point so I felt the Guzmaker would offer some lategame benefit to the village ensuring they could always win the lynch. Also the name is really funny.

Walrein said he would be idle the first night so he either got conveniently randed the Guzmaker who could do nothing until N1 at the earliest if Guzma got mislynched or I swapped him to it, don’t remember now. He stepped up to lead feeling he had a provable role that indicated Guzma was in the game and nobody else was doing it. Revealing his role meant the mafia knew it existed and got to kill off lategame power plus the leader in one by bus drivering him with LG twice. Walrein distrusted Moody heavily to the point he killed himself the second time by not having FI BG used on himself. FailFish. Walrein was more conservative as a leader than Sam and wanted to clean people with info roles and idle LG’s vig shot. Considering the numbers the mafia were approaching I think idling the shot was indeed a mistake, but Walrein accurately read a lot of villagers as town and set up a good framework for the other sheeted users to win with. He was the only sheeted user who died and he died twice! He did boozle hard by not sheeting LG (or anyone) before N1 ended, leading to nobody being on the sheet and Pidge taking advantage of this chaos to get a mislynch in. Luckily for him, the shubaka revive let him sheet LG and shubaka and then Sam and get the village into a much stronger position before the mafia took him out, again. I do feel like they overprioritized killing this role. It was a vanilla role until Twin died and they certainly weren’t touching him for quite a long time. That said Walrein probably has the best grasp on Yetigame meta so killing him off before he could suss out the inconsistent mafia claims wasn’t a bad call.

Hitmonleet / Bike / Humanity Checker

This is another role that really only works well in a closed game. I wanted not-vanilla but also very weak. This was a very weak info role for a closed theme. Hitmonleet took someone for a ride and determined if they were human (could ride) or not (couldn’t ride). This role could catch a couple people out. Xurkitree and Nihilego depending. The AF side of the mafia, it couldn’t as long as they used their given safeclaims. It could semi-clean someone in that if they claimed a human role and turned up as human, that was consistent, but it couldn’t verify beyond that.

Hitmonleet was the first victim of the faked Ariados results and he posted his role name, allowing the mafia to info kill him. Again, he wasn’t a great target. They had a very successful N1 but all 3 of the kills were onto pretty weak roles, especially since they had zorbees somewhat pocketed with Pidge. Hitmonleet took his dispute with Blazade public which led to the mafia knowing the village SG and martyring or hooking him every single night. So he could never do anything. I think Hitmonleet may have been too hasty here in doing so, since as I said before Blazade claiming Ariados but denying the flavor made no sense as Ariados wouldn’t be AF or UB. But I understand what his rationale was.

Haruno / Lillie / Rogue + Miller

I was scraping the barrel for role names by this point and decided to put Lillie on Skull as a miller because she sure sounds like she’d be on AF, not Skull! I made this a second rogue that learned who killed it but could only target two people. Nothing Haruno said about the role was true lmao. The role did not know it was a miller but could probably guess by the fact its name was Lillie.

Haruno………………….
I think everyone has some Words about Haruno, both in general and in this game. Haruno knew his role name was shady but the direction he went with the lies (then claiming he rooted out the fake Guzma, von, but…) was Interesting. It might have worked if his lies had made sense, IE not claiming AF and UB were indeed separate or would become separate. The game was a 1v1 as I never split AF and UB into 5 and 5 after the size was increased, so Haruno saying otherwise made him look way too suspicious. OTOH why would a mafian even bother claiming this crap? I think you can tell when Haruno is town by how ridiculous his claims are because no mafia would ever bother saying something so patently false.
This role became the prototypical D1ROGUEMISLYNCH though. When will you ever learn.

KnightsofCydonia / Throne / Numbers Watcher

More bottom of the barrel role nameage here. This role was a watcher of sorts but a weaker one than normal, in that it got no usernames. Just the number of members of its own team who targeted that target. I think I may have overpowered it letting it see the numbers for previous nights if it was successful as well, especially since lategame it could have rooted out mafia as the numbers dwindled and the chances for 0 targets dropped.

KoC was probably my favorite action-sender and always added some flair to his action. I don’t think he ever got sheeted but he was a sort of nebulous info role the mafia knew about but never took out, I think because they were uncertain what he was. He was used in the D1 Haruno mess but his result was inconclusive. He had the right idea to seek people who targeted Haruno N0 to try and see if the mafia would claim to have done it and be caught out as non-Skull but IIRC his role’s details got leaked D1 so Asek refrained from claiming. His Huge Play was catching people on Blazade which then let him see the previous Blazade targets, exposing like 3 mafia as non-Skull, which was good but also when the mafia decided to pubreveal. Still, if they hadn’t it would’ve been bigly.

Aura Guardian / Shady House / Unkillable

AKA “what do I put in this slot that’s not vanilla-proper but not too strong?” Sorry AG you got a no-night action role that did nothing except fail to ever die at night. Which was a pretty shady claim considering all the 1 mafia had to do was never kill potential teammember AG and wow, his claim’s legit! This role is probably anus.

He almost got mislynched a couple times due to Pidge’s play. I think there was some reason to suspect AG as opportunistic on D1 but he was a pretty active villager after that so I think never actually lynching him was justified. He certainly made the effort to be town and offered to godkill himself to prove he was village. I think he should have gone harder into a 1v1 with Pidge hard accusing him of lying due to the 1 of Acklow/AG being bad dynamic. And godkilling to clean yourself is a shady mechanic, a lot of hosts wouldn’t permit it, but it’s an UncleSam mislynch staple by this point.

Overall I think the village had some organization and info control problems. A lot of people claimed to Pidge due to Walrein’s sheet snafu and they let a lot of info get into the thread such as SG Blazade. However they did try and coordinate to clean people and stop mafia actions. They got extremely lucky in lynching both Asek and acidphoenix, the two strongest mafia roles (maybe Earlio was equal with acid) in a row when if those two stuck around, the village very likely lost. Walrein getting Smarter to the meta helped them a good deal, though Haruno as a rogue sabotaged that and led to the Classic Mislynch. I don’t think this was an undeserving village win but there was some great fortune in their lynch choices. Also KoC randomly picking pancake, the hooker, instead of like jalmont or FH, was some more Lucky Duck. If only they had ever once followed Twin in lynching off von!

Pancake / Wicke / Hooker

Standard mafia hooker.

Pancake was pretty active in mafia planning. Like the rest of his team he claimed his fake kind of late and then they decided his results wouldn’t be believable as a result of making the Skull Tanks be 2x BPVs. Snype’s Kidnap probably harmed this from being plausible. He worked with his team and put in effort so good mafia play overall, especially when you don’t have a role to fake with.

vonFiedler / Lusamine / Mole + Mayor + Silencer

I should have made Lusamine a freezer considering what she does to beautiful things. SMH. This role was made to counter Guzma, or at least prevent Guzma from being considered auto-clean. Maybe even get Guzma lynched! It displayed a Guzma PM that had the BPV line changed to Unlynchable from Twin’s actual PM. It had a mayor vote to be able to compete with the actual Guzma if pressed for numbers vote testing, which people considered doing, and the silence was hidden from the Guzma side.

I switched von and Twin because the latter requested village and I figured this would be an Interesting faceoff. Von had previously been a Big Player as janitor in ELECTRO so I thought with a built-in mole PM he would be able to do work again. I think he got frustrated the town also had a Guzma/randoms claimed Guzma, though, and he was never inspected. The village thought he was a double silencer because of Earlio’s fake results. I think that was a good use of Earlio’s role, to make this one seem like it hit 2 people. Von was part of a miscalculation that the mafia made when they tried to seize the memes of voting. As long as all non-silenced (both the real and fake) villagers voted unanimously, the mafia were never winning that day in the lynch. I think this was their biggest misplay since it revealed all of them but ultimately never was going to work. Bust.

Ditto / Gladion / Martyr

This role name made more sense on Team Skull but that was the ploy! It was also a flavorless martyr so it could be used to pose as town without looking suspicious, or used for nefarious mafia gains without making town!Gladion’s claim suspicious. I feel that the mafia combo of hooker and martyr might have been a bit too much action dictation control. I would caution other hosts against letting one team have both.

There is much to say about Ditto in any game he plays in. Or perhaps, not enough. I have often lamented his activity in postgames. This game, I find him to be active, but like most of the other mafia mole roles, underutilized. I thought his Goo-zma claim was cute and creative and would have encouraged it more had it been by the Wicke slot or something. Claiming Gladion the village martyr was a much better/safer claim in my personal opinion and the village leadership did buy it. I think he was the least suspected of his team alongside Earlio. At the very least, the village considered offering him protection to martyr a mafia kill. 20/20, I would have switched Ditto and pancake or Flyhn to let Ditto have a ‘better’ Goo-zma in and let the Gladion in be utilized a bit more.

Pidge / Faba / Insane Cop (does not know sanity)

“Why is this on our team are there neutrals??????????” the mafia refrain on this role. This was their only info role and it was absolutely useless to them. However, it did let them pretend to be Sam’s “twin” of Grunt B, the opposite-sanity cop. I wanted to encourage them to get their information both for FH’s kill and general location of BG/SG/hooker by moling, not just inspecting people. So they got this, which was really only a counterpart mole role.

Pidge made an attempt to find Grunt A but Sam didn’t react to it at first; they found each other. He made a Big Play claiming 1 of AG and Acklow was mafia which I think was risky considering they didn’t yet know Sam’s results. Then it became clear Sam had to be sane and Pidge’s insane claim was wrong. People suspecting both were sane was a bit bonkers to me. Pidge stuck around for a very long time which I think was a detriment to his team, not for any player reasons but because if his slot had been lynched before Asek or acid his team would have been in a much stronger position if not straight up the game winners. Pidge did get some solid claims off of his claim even if I thought it was ill-fated, including the nightkill vig which allowed them to martyr Texas’s shot into their omniguard and absorb it. He and von were probably the most active planners of their team though others weren’t far behind. I think this was a very good game for Pidge.

Flyhn / Aether Grunt / Backup Guard

This role was really to give the mafia a weaker guard so all was not lost if acid died. Omniguard is very strong defensively but could not be used offensively to block bodyguards like normaly safeguard could, but that’s okay, they had bus driver (which couldn’t work through safeguard, though)! This role could’ve been used that way. Until omni died, this role would fail as long as omni succeeded, and if omni failed, this role would activate as specified.

Flyhn claimed some kind of bodyguard role that Walrein was okay with but Sam immediately thought was shady af and vigged. The mafia struggled to get good claims for their guard roles. Flyhn at least got himself his claim and claimed it. About all I have here. You never expect Flyhn to be the team leader.

Jalmont / Nihilego / Mole

This role could appear as a player-generated role PM, to anyone the player had claimed that role name to. Jalmont could have appeared as different things to Aubisio and LightWolf post-Aubisio’s death, for instance. The caveat was it had to be a private claim, using #circus wouldn’t work. It could have been very powerful and I think a role of this sort on the mafia in a big game where there are more info roles could be extremely strong to give them an in. I had intended for it to be a set mole role of Golisopod alongside Guzma but changed that and decided to make it require some more effort on the part of the player, but also offer great gain.

I think Jalmont eventually did get a Masquerain claim together for it but never claimed it to Aubisio. I think he did to Sam so he would have copped as Good off of that. This was another mafia mole role that was underutilized. Jalmont didn’t really claim to many people and idled the PM almost every night before finally getting one, and then pubrevealing anyway. If this role had been on someone a bit more active/proactive, it could have moled deep into the village. Ah well. I thought it was cool in potential. When Ullar subbed in he was in favor of some more aggressive tactics such as using Earlio’s role as a persuade, onto Twin, instead of the double silence. I think he was right they needed a Big Play especially as the number of relevant roles dwindled.

Acidphoenix / Guzzlord / Omniguard

Typical.

This was a role whose flavor made it obvious it was mafia but was also very beneficial to mafia. As such it had no good role claims. I don’t even remember what acidphoenix eventually claimed but I think it was okay, until KoC caught it as not town targeting Blazade. Acid was on the inactive side of his team but he was present and voted with them.

Earlio / Xurkitree / Results Faker

A role that could provide fake results sounded cool. It could either add to results or totally replace them but it couldn’t replace the silence result. It could be used to clean members of the mafia via inspections or cops or giving someone the proper flavor, or it could be used more maliciously against the village as they did with the fake silences. This was also one that would be caught by Hitmonleet as it had a human safeclaim.

Earlio did well in his first OC game on Smogon, not sure if he’s played elsewhere. His team was very helpful to him and told him what to say to Twin, which is always good to see as a host that a newbie isn’t left to flail. He was pretty active though it was mostly his more experienced teammates fussing over exactly how to word his faked results and what to put in them. I think this was the most meticulously done action. LightWolf posted before noticing he was silenced but wasn’t godkilled; the mafia weren’t sure how LW had realized his silence was fake and if he had told Sam about it or not. This was a bit unfortunate for them that they felt a persuade wouldn’t be believed since one of the silences was already “exposed.”

Asek / Buzzwole / Extra Kill + Bus Driver

Lawdy this was a good slot role-wise. Obviously the mafia needed more than one regular kill to stand a chance so I gave them a designated second killer, who could also perform the first kill, making this an ideal perma-omni target, AND could bus drive. This meant whoever they wanted dead, died, as they could swap them away from protection (barring the FI BG that outsped it). I think this singular role was too good, which was a benefit to the mafia early on but became a huge hindrance once it went down and they lost both their second kill and their bypass of protection.

Asek was active and engaged but struggled to get a good fakeclaim IIRC. I was pretty AFK when they came up with it so I’m not sure whose idea 2x vig was, but it was unfortunately pretty non-meta. If the village only had one charge vig, and that one hadn’t already shot Flyhn, it might have been a safer claim that would at least be contested or even believed alongside. However, with two charge vigs and LG ‘proven,’ Asek’s claim just had no room on the village. If it was JUST 2x vig it might have been okay but the mafia dramatically misstepped with the inclusion of the “pierces janitor” element. With a cardflip on/off role, janitor is hard countered. This role would have been a great claim in ELECTRO or especially MAGS2 but in a game the mafia KNEW revolved around the cardflip control, not janitor, I think it was a poor choice to go this route. Maybe they were trying to bolster Pidge’s claim for Acklow/AG but the knowledge of the ‘village numbers guys’ was out there already, Pidge was sunk. I regret I didn’t get a chance to speak up about the 2x vig not being ideal for a village claim. If I had to do this role over again, I would try and distribute its power better, so the mafia weren’t Winning while it was alive and Losing once it died.

Former Hope / Celesteela / Announcer + 2x Info Killer

I did some speculative calculations in my head and felt the mafia’s odds of winning were about equal to the village’s with just a liiittle more killing power than their factional and Asek’s kills allowed for. However, this was not to be for free! They had to match a role name to the username they wanted to kill, and if the info was wrong or the kill was blocked, it was lost. The role also had an announcer as a fakeclaim opportunity which FH did try with his Alola Raticate safeclaim. Announcer is always kind of a dicey role because it goes in and out of its general trend: either vanilla-with-an-action village role or mafia-its-usually-village fakeclaim role. When announcer gets on mafia too many games straight it shifts back to village to be ‘suspicious’ and so forth. You can do stuff with voting power in its announcement if you want to give it something more to do.

Former Hope was another active mafia member and used his announce to get his safeclaim out there but I don’t think he really pushed it beyond claiming to leadership who he was, which I guess is all you can do when they recognize announcer is obviously a Real Role but NAI. He made a super late 2x info vig claim after Asek went down for that same claim (essentially) which I think was a sizeable misplay. I would have left the claim at announcer and seen where my chips fell. The mafia used Earlio’s role to get a couple rolenames to use for this, resulting in Hitmonleet’s death. They planned on doing it to shubaka as a rand but once he used his revive figured why bother and tried it on Sam instead. The kill got absorbed by his kidnap BPV and led to Asek’s lynch. This was such an unlucky combination, that their extra kill was wasted on the BPV and that Sam lived through it and bullied his way to an Asek lynch. If the numbers were 1 less village I think the mafia could still win around this loss.

Overall, this was a good mafia team. They were all pretty active and contributing. They had probably the best N1 of any mafia in recent history. I felt bad that after Asek’s death it seemed to be a slow limp to the finish line of defeat and they had little way to recover. I do think they made some misplays: their mole roles were generally underutilized or neglected and the role aspect of their fakeclaims left something to be desired (though Sam is some kind of fakeclaim drug-sniffing-dog savant, idk how he does it). Yes, they did get unlucky, in the sense the village kept randing their best remaining roles to lynch without knowing what they really were. They’d hypothesize Asek was a BG piercer or asek was an omni then admit that was all speculative BS and they had no reason to. RIP. Sorry guys you couldn’t pull off the win.

This team didn’t have an inspector or role checker to motivate them to get their info by moling well. They did know where most of the important village roles were (I think they were uncertain what Aubisio was and thought him likely inspector but not definitively) as a result of Pidge and general village incompetence in keeping their good roles under wraps. I think they made a couple of poorer choices in their targets on N1 that could have benefited them more if they had aimed for other village members in the hopes of getting stronger roles.

Another critical error was their pubreveal on a lynch they had no numerical way of winning. If they had stayed undercover longer (I mean most of them were on the suspect list but still) it’s possible they could’ve gotten a no lynch tie or mislynch off with some patience. I think they erred greatly in lynching Blazade because he was still heavily suspected by the village. If they had tried to lynch Fort instead, well, the village never really doubted him especially with confirmation of the danceoff flavor. And this would’ve left Blazade open as a possible mafian in the eyes of the village. Again, I get why, but going on Blazade was very unfortunate; I’m not sure if they knew the village didn’t trust him much. I also think they should have tried the fake persuade sooner, or on Twin. Again, I knew LW didn’t really figure out his silence was fake, but I get they were concerned the jig was up.

I think the best way to summarize this game is ‘swingy.’ As long as Asek (and the omni or at least some sort of protection to keep village hooker/SG away) was alive the game swung heavily in favor of mafia. They were closing in on having majority after like N3 if Asek stayed alive. Once Asek died, the game swung back to the village who only had to deal with one kill a night now. I do think this shows both teams had fair shots of winning so the balance wasn’t like, far off from right, but it was too powerfully shifted based on the life or death of one slot. Schrodinger’s Asek, if you will.

I hope everyone had fun regardless. I would appreciate feedback on how well people feel this game navigated some issues common to closed (and narrow) themes limiting the mafia’s ability to blend in while also offering ways to catch them out. I do think there are some good role experiments within this game other hosts should check out and consider using, especially on the weaker side of things when you don’t want to make someone actionless vanilla because feelsbadman but you don’t want them to be a huge factor.

Village MVP: UncleSam for deciding to bigdick lynch Asek at a critical point and generally being assertive with the roles; I think the case could also be made for Walrein who accurately found his own teammates and got the framework established for Sam to win. Both had some errors (Blazade continually being mistrusted and left to get hooked or martyred, even by his own team; not adding anyone else to sheet before dying) but overall did a lot for the village.
Mafia MVP: Pidge, I think he took the most direct action to try and get into the village. I think his insane inspector dichotomy between Acklow and AG was a very risky play but I respect him making it and getting several claims including Texas off it. Runner up would probably be von who was active and tried to persuade poor, confused young villagers to vote with him, though he did get kind of defeatist.
Best Play: Omniguarding Asek every night and using him as the factional killer as well.
Worst Play: Either pubrevealing when the mafia numerically couldn’t win the lynch or Walrein not sheeting anyone else before the end of N1 which let Pidge slide into everyone’s DMs.
Best Worst Play: Walrein originally putting Moody’s FI BG on himself then deciding he just didn’t trust Moody and trying to use Snype as protection, leading to his second death. God bless u babby Spheal.
??? Play: I think the village told Former Hope to use his vig shot on Paperblade to activate his rogue role. Why would you tell someone potentially suspicious who your rogue is. They’ll never die now.
Best Soap Opera: Young Fort being torn in two by suspicious door visitor vonFiedler and A Hoard Of Loud Yelling Villagers on a critical vote he thought ended the next day.

Dank Logs:

Paperblade - 04/26/2017
tbh
I can't believe that
sam is not guzma
when my role is guzma's babby boy
I got demoted to twin's kid???
champyeti - 04/26/2017
LMAO
Paperblade - 04/26/2017
everyone is offended by haruno calling them retards but this is the real insult here

Paperblade - 04/26/2017
I feel like von is drunk rn
like everyone is flaming haruno
and he's waxing about how he's gonna get twin lynched


Twin - Last Tuesday at 7:30 PM
sam thinks i'm a neutral that wins with fucking lusamine
champyeti - Last Tuesday at 7:30 PM
lol
Twin - Last Tuesday at 7:30 PM
my action is to make sam not haruno
Tyvm

champyeti - Last Thursday at 3:36 PM
u got an action 4 me
Ghostwheel - Last Thursday at 3:48 PM
hit twin i guess
i'm just going to the martyr anyway
idk why sam
even fucking bothers
champyeti - Last Thursday at 3:48 PM
if at first u dont succeed
Ghostwheel - Last Thursday at 3:48 PM
i mean I have the solution
in my own tool box
if he ever let me SG himself
that martyr wouldn't even work the next night

LightWolf - 05/01/2017
What does my bamboozle protection actually do.
champyeti - 05/01/2017
protects against bamboozles
LightWolf - 05/01/2017
I expected this reply

champyeti - 04/30/2017
what do u make of the roles u have obtained
LightWolf - 04/30/2017
It's ya boi Taurus?
Can't decide who guzmaker could be
Outside of lusamine
champyeti - 04/30/2017
do u even read the thread

champyeti - 04/26/2017
u kno the role u claim isnt how ur role actually works right
Haruno - 04/26/2017
yh
but i have to come up with some bullshit
and seeing as what my role
ill almost certainly be killed/hooked
and I'm confident enough ill be able to target whoever kills me
if i do still get myslynched, then twin is instantly fucked
and regardless of his alignment that's a win for me
champyeti - 04/26/2017
kk
Haruno - 04/27/2017
Shoutouts to me
For getting village in check o.o

shubaka17 - Last Sunday at 5:53 PM
@everyone twin asked to be added to sheet
Walrein - Last Sunday at 5:55 PM
use @ alive from now on instead of @ everyone
made a new role so i'd get less notifications


shubaka17 - Last Sunday at 12:02 PM
according to KoC's results, ditto and acid are both liars
so uh
lynch on Acid makes a LOT of sense
just read smogon, lynching the announcer makes less sense than the demon we don't know. blazade is still probable scum, but we know he isn't omniguard bc of vF. texas is possible scum since his kill failed, but that's for two phases in the future.
Sadviolin.mp4

LG - Last Sunday at 8:53 AM
Did Pancake give you the bpv
Paperblade - Last Sunday at 8:54 AM
what if the bpv is a bomb :thinking:

shubaka17 - Yesterday at 3:55 AM
tfw blazade was legit
and i almost lost town game bc of massive amounts of Mafia Power

pancake - Last Thursday at 8:11 PM
the one issue at this point is
if twin decides he doesn't care enough
and so he's like fuck it I'll kill myself
but i find it more likely that he lynches
Ironically


pancake - Last Thursday at 7:53 PM
this is great guys
Aubisio - Today at 10:53 PM
but it seems like noone uses Inspect
its SO easy
did he just reveal himself as inspector
or did I misread
vonFiedler - Last Thursday at 7:54 PM
no
he means inspect element
pancake - Last Thursday at 7:55 PM
oh
vonFiedler - Last Thursday at 7:55 PM
the f12 key

vonFiedler - Last Sunday at 6:36 PM
and as the op says
whoever has the least idlers wins
so I can sympathize with the village if we win this vote

-->

vonFiedler - Last Wednesday at 9:28 PM
I've never complained post game
but I've never had a game losing host extension into a game losing opponent idle

Tfw village idles to victory

Ullar - Last Wednesday at 7:15 PM
tfw von is more defeatist than an archen with 49% hp

pancake - Last Wednesday at 12:04 PM
I mean
we kill aubisio by godkill and i die
or
zoa - Last Wednesday at 12:04 PM
its not a real persuade
pancake - Last Wednesday at 12:04 PM
oh
wait
zoa - Last Wednesday at 12:04 PM
he wont be godkilled :neutral_face:

zoa - Last Sunday at 10:44 PM
that awkward moment when you dont get anymore night action commands from the faction you are 'moling'

vonFiedler - Last Sunday at 9:24 PM
FortColors - Today at 9:22 PM
oooh
twin
ok
so uhm
their reasoning for saying that you're scum
is apparently
"twin is a bad liar so he's obviously guzma"
...................

vonFiedler - Last Sunday at 5:48 PM
this is no longer a hidden info game
we can outplay the mafia
er
village

When ur method acting goes so deep u forget ur informed faction in ur secret discord channel isnt actually the village
 

UncleSam

Leading this village
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
I liked this game a lot, though I think Yeti misunderstood a few things from the postgame (overall very well done hosting it with how busy you were qt <3). I did have a lot of comments to make so:
- Blazade wasn't really mistrusted in the sense of me ever thinking he was more than 50 / 50 mafia; I was never lynching Blazade because I DID comment on how weird it was for the Ariados flavor to be showing up with an Ariados claim, and to I was the first person to suspect then essentially tell the villagers that there must be a fake claiming role out there.
- I hooked Blazade because I was pretty sure Fort was clear but wanted to be 100%, wanted to see what flavor Blazade reported, and wanted more village target roles on Knights' target. I didn't really care much about the Safeguard (though in retrospect I should've listened to Texas and Safeguarded him - I just felt that with a known Mafia redirector / Martyr it would be a bit futile, particularly in the event Blazade was actually mafia). Overall this result confirmed all of Ditto, acid, and Pidge (more on him later) as mafia so I don't regret it.
- I'm not sure where the sense that I 'trusted' Pidge comes from. I never shared any particular role information outside of 'I was cleaned by the inspector', and though I did initially think Pidge was 90% likely to be village, after the Acklow mislynch I rapidly lowered my estimation of his cleanliness and was in fact the only person come D3 who didn't want to lynch off of his result on AG after the mislynch on Acklow. The reason for the extension is pretty simple: I was flying / in transit for the vast majority of the 24 hours and was going to have to publicly reveal to get Asek lynched over Aura Guardian, who there was no way in hell I was ever letting get lynched (particularly after talking to Twin and Gaius starting to agree with me more and more). I would've publicly revealed the night before and sent PMs to everyone to change their roles, but Yeti said it was fine to extend 24 hours so I could give shubaka a bit more time to come around if he was going to. Of course he didn't, so the extension didn't really help us it just guaranteed that I was going to have to publicly reveal in order to prevent what I considered a likely mislynch.
- Speaking of the Asek lynch, I think the mafia misplayed this one pretty hard. von, Pidge, and pancake all made bizarre excuses to either not lynch Asek or try to lynch Blazade / AG, which made me even more suspicious of Pidge in particular and guaranteed that I was never mislynching either of those other two, most likely even if Aubisio reported one as mafia (because of how little I was trusting inspect results at that point). There was just no way to swing this one reliably and it could've been a great opportunity to earn massive townpoints by going against a villager (shubaka) and lynching an insanely strong mafia role. I get why they needed the role alive, however - it was effectively their win condition and it's sort of bad luck that I happened to pick out Asek's claim as being the worst when several other mafia had pretty bad ones (I considered acid and Jalmont for that lynch as well based on their claims, and either would've been infinitely better for the mafia to lose).
- The mafia attempt to take over the lynch was a bit futile but was very bold and could've won the game instantly, so I'm not sure quite how I feel about it. It is true that at that point in time I had gotten the village into a position where the mafia were going to have to rely on a terrible mislynch at some point, but I think the mafia should've held off until they found a way to eliminate me before outing themselves so obviously. There is one big reason for this (next point).
- I think the mafia misplayed with Earlio's role, which was extremely strong so long as no one suspected it but which I rapidly became suspicious of. Initially I thought it was a Framer, but I was suspicious of it simply being a results generator as well. If the mafia had stuck to fairly simple results (or even consistent ones - the mafia could've been sending people 'persuaded' results from the dawn of time and we would've believed they had a persuader 100%, which would've given them the game), I think they win this game. The biggest misplay, however, had to do with pancake's use (or rather decision to not-use) of it on N3 and the surrounding optics of it combined with his Blazade vote D4. Specifically, I have no clue why the mafia didn't just stick with their initial fake result sent to me. The fact that they could replicate the Po Tank flavor made it a very convincing fake, and indeed even with the 'host mistake' flavor I bumped pancake up on the sheet in terms of cleanliness over Blazade / AG and just a tick below the confirmed villagers. This led me to having a big headache on D4 because, with a revealed Aether Grunt, known 7 UBs + Thicc hooker (aka Wicke), and almost 100% Lusamine, that meant there were 10 overall mafia (at least). However, try as I might, I could not find convincing reasons for more than 9 people to be mafia - I knew that Flyhn and Asek were as they were dead, I knew that von was (I suspected Twin was neutral potentially who could win with either Lusamine or the Village kek, oh well we lost nothing from it and I made clear we never ever lynch Twin or distrust that he can win with us as well or any stupid nonsense like that), and acid / Pidge / Ditto had been confirmed via Knights. Former Hope was inspected as Celesteela with a fairly useless / spent role so we weren't gonna lynch him, and Jalmont / one of Earlio or Moody (likely Earlio at that point, though initially I thought Earlio was more likely the clean one) were almost certainly mafia based on their claims. That made 9 probable mafia, but I couldn't bring myself to believe that anyone else was truly mafia after pancake's host mistake result and the mafia pushes onto AG / Blazade. I considered many scenarios in my head wherein the mafia could be bussing AG or Blazade, wherein they could only have 9 people somehow, or where even Aubisio could potentially be a mole. Pancake lynching Blazade gave him away badly in that sense, though I'm certain I'd have never given him sheet because I wasn't even giving Fort / Aubisio / Twin sheet due to having four 100% cleaned villagers in myself / Gaius / Paperblade / shubaka (though after the Asek lynch I briefly played with the idea of a mafia!shubaka reviver role that had to target villagers so targeted Walrein for the kek lmao). In any case, if they had done this they 100% could've killed me on N4 so long as pancake doesn't out, and they could've claimed some sort of BPV-piercer ala Asek's claim to explain it. I don't know whether the other villagers would've bought that but at least it would've gotten me out of the way and given them an opening to mislynch someone, as it was very hard to mislynch anyone while I was around.
- Imo the mafia had to kill me N1 to win this game, and got very unlucky not with extensions or lynch votes (which imo they made some miscalculations on and votes which were never going to change - no way in hell at that point would I let Aubisio vote against us because we KNEW (and I told him) the mafia had a results faker at that point so he was not going to be voting against our lynch) but with Walrein putting Snype on me to send me on an Adventure and earning me a BPV in the process. I don't know the likelihood of gaining a BPV from this, but Yeti mentioned that it was also possible to die by going on an adventure so at the very least if I had picked the wrong directionality here the mafia would've won 100%. The fact that I was cagey and never let anyone know I earned a BPV from this (not even Walrein much less Pidge or Aubisio) is why I never asked for protection this night. On N1, however, I was still relatively tuned-out of the game and only made a token ask for protection from Walrein, which I was pretty sure he was not going to grant. If the mafia had swapped a kill on zorbees for a kill on me and used the flip to 'clean' Pidge in many others' eyes I think they win this game quite easily, as I was the only person who didn't want to lynch based on Pidge results D3 and spearheaded that entire lynch (plus obviously controlling the village afterwards).
- Walrein did quite well in the organization aspect, and as Yeti mentioned laid the groundwork for a village comeback. I was very impressed he had forced claims and results out of every single player, as if he had not I am quite certain I wouldn't have been active enough in the early going to do it myself. Meanwhile, his passcodes sent around were incredibly helpful because they let me proxy through Twin to various players without outright revealing myself initially while also letting me alter his orders N2 a lot. Speaking of the N2 orders - I think Walrein is good at gutreading town (as he hasn't sheeted mafia in quite a few games of village leading iirc), but is just really, really passive with his actions and gutreading scum. He was idling a vig shot that I told him we had to use on Flyhn, and he was inspecting a bunch of goods (and of course my altered targets didn't get switched to because Aubisio was fairly AFK and didn't get on to change it) when we wanted to be inspecting likely bads instead. So great job to Walrein despite the missteps with actions because your organization and not-getting-moled in the most critical part of the game and despite numerous mafia roles built to do so was why I was able to take our existing organization and win the game off of it after you died.

Other shout-outs to players who I thought did well:
- Lord Gaius, Paperblade, Knightsofcydonia, and Twin all did really, really well for the village, and without them it is not an underestimation to say the village would not have won. Their activity ensured that the Asek and acid lynches went through, which was huge because I wasn't able to be particularly active on those day cycles.
- shubaka and Fort Colorcastle, despite some of my public overrulings of them, both did very well this game and both demonstrated an ability to think critically beyond what a village leader simply tells you. I think that both of their flaw this game is the same: they're both more experienced with playing on a NOC village vs. an OC village, and so are more likely to say things like 'we gain info from this if it is a mislynch' or 'I'm holding off on voting because I want to be certain', both of which are perfectly acceptable NOC arguments but which don't really work on an OC village with 24 hour day deadlines where you have to lynch people who you know are mafia and you have to do it quickly or else the mafia will take over.
- von played really really well, and I admire his method act even when it's 100% obvious he is mafia. Of course he wasn't going to be able to change my mind, but he almost got other villagers to do so even when me and a bunch of other cleaned villagers were yelling at them otherwise. His planning was good though I do think there were a few mafia roles that could've been used better, particularly the results faker.
- Pidge did well as well, initially earning my trust and making a great play of it early on with his 'check' on my role PM structure that was quite convincing. He also caused one mislynch and almost another (if I hadn't been there / had a BPV from Snype), which would've won them the game.
- pancake was the last mafia who I couldn't figure out, and I only discovered because he voted Blazade (and with a fairly incriminating post as well which made it a bit easier to justify to Fort why he was mafia - probably should've stuck with somewhat non-commital 'Blazade's results don't make any sense to me and I think he is the correct lynch' though I would've assumed you were mafia anyway afterwards tbf), so well done on that.

So ya, good game all and well-done to my fellow villagers, as many of you played quite well and frankly it was very possible with this setup for the village to just get steamrolled in an embarrassing fashion. Of course, once the mafia are found out it is also very possible for the mafia to get steamrolled in a similar fashion, so in that sense I agree with Walrein that it was a very swingy game. Even if the mafia hadn't revealed on D4 I think I would've confirmed all of them except pancake relatively quickly; I do think that the mafia's best chance at that point was to kill me, find Aubisio and kill him, and just stall things out for late game because von was never getting lynched. Of course, they didn't quite have the numbers in the end if pancake could only force one mislynch and even if they killed me on N4 I had already cleaned AG at that point I think so they'd have had a tough (but not impossible) narrative to sell of pancake > Blazade in cleanliness in the best case scenario, so maybe aiming for the instant win was the higher percentage play. Idk, it's easy to criticize something that almost works but fails due to a pretty obvious flaw (being outvoted even with the fake silencer result).

ggwp
 

Andy Snype

Mr. Music
oh i suggested targeting UncleSam with the adventure. i thought it super sketchy for there to be a game where sam did not actually try to lead, which made me suspect he would be a notable person (that I thought would be mafia) and walrein did not oppose it when i suggested sam as a target. memes aside, i don't recall being in a game with unclesam where he did not actually try to lead so i thought his lack of desire to lead was sketch. even when other people take the rein (no pun intended), he's somehow one of the more active proponents of village leadership and manages to get into the position of telling other people what to do, so his lack of trying really made me question his cleanliness. poor unclesam though, damned if he tries to lead, damned if he doesn't.

i really wanted to just backseat cruise this game, and it would have been nice for there to have been a contingency plan upon walrein's death, so i claimed to pidge and hoped for the best still thinking that sam was dirty and we saw how that turned out.
 

Ampharos

tag walls, punch fascists
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
Speaking of the N2 orders - I think Walrein is good at gutreading town (as he hasn't sheeted mafia in quite a few games of village leading iirc), but is just really, really passive with his actions and gutreading scum.
agree 100% with this assessment - my main flaw in both my NOC and OC play is that i'm much better at finding town than i am at finding scum, and my self-awareness in this regard often leads me to be overcautious in jumping to conclusions re: the latter

what eventually got me to agree to have flyhn shot, ironically enough, is that i didn't trust moody - and what village has a backup BG but no initial BG?

so yeah, memes
 
I was super confused during the game because of all the lynch modifers (former, guzmaker, twin, von, silencer), but after thinking about it more it was rather interesting to have votes be less calculable.
 

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