Project LC Research Week Closed for Now (Won by Fille)

I'm lazy as fuck but still gonna post something I guess.
Don't know how high I laddered. Think like 1380ish. Didn't legit ladder for RW for more than like an hour. Mons were boring imo.


Sandyghast

Don't like wall set, chipped too easily and is just meh overall with knock everywhere.

RP.
Love the RP set. I personally run evio, RP, earth power, shadow ball, destiny bond. It's a fun mid game chipper and d bond catches people off guard and get's you a free kill 8 battles of 10.


Pikipek. Just... eh. Rufflet, Vulla and Doduo all do it better. Only niche is bullet seed which isn't strong enough to use it over jump kick doduo or superpower rufflet. Scarf is by far the best set, but even then I'd make it C+ at best

Overall the most viable of this week, definitely bray
Sandy and Piki both have niches but they're small and rare.
Yungoos is just bad. I tried using it and I enjoy it but it's just bad. I ran scarf and LO taunt. They were eh.
 
PS Username: Adam the First
Ladder Username: RW Adam
Pokemon(s): Pikipek


Pikipek @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Skill Link
Level: 5
EVs: 236 Atk / 36 SpD / 236 Spe
Adamant Nature
- U-turn
- Bullet Seed
- Return / Brick Break
- Brave Bird

The only set that actually worked for me is the scarf one. Pikipek is a really good wallbreaker and with the speed it has it can clean whole games after some of his checks/counter are weakened/dead like Pawniard, Defensive Vullaby, Grimer-Alola, Magnemite, Chinchou and others. In my opinion this pokemon is gonna have a big space in the meta and in a month it will probably be at least rank A-

Here is the team I used and built this weekend which is around Scarf Pikipek + Volturn + Diglett.


Pikipek @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Skill Link
Level: 5
EVs: 236 Atk / 36 SpD / 236 Spe
Adamant Nature
- U-turn
- Bullet Seed
- Return
- Brave Bird

Diglett @ Focus Sash
Ability: Arena Trap
Level: 5
EVs: 236 Atk / 36 SpD / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Sucker Punch
- Stealth Rock

Foongus @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 5
EVs: 124 HP / 160 Def / 160 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Spore
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Chinchou @ Berry Juice
Ability: Volt Absorb
Level: 5
EVs: 76 HP / 212 Def / 152 SpA / 60 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 1 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Scald
- Volt Switch
- Hidden Power [Ground]
- Heal Bell

Vullaby @ Eviolite
Ability: Overcoat
Level: 5
EVs: 116 HP / 76 Atk / 236 Def / 76 SpD
Impish Nature
- Roost
- U-turn
- Brave Bird
- Defog

Mienfoo @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 5
EVs: 196 Def / 36 SpD / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off
- U-turn
- Poison Jab


Ladder Screen:

Sorry if I didn't ladder a lot but i didn't have much time to do so. I also forgot the replays, sorry ;-;
But I found this new meta really fun and easy too o.o
 

freezai

Live for the Applause
is a Tiering Contributor
Congratulations to this week's winner Fille, with a whopping 1485 ladder points at an 81 gxe clip and an impressive display of research on Pikipek! Be sure you give Fille a round of applause next time you see our budding young scientist n_n.


Honorable mentions to Laroxyl (1424) and Plasmagby (1374) who placed second and third respectively.
1.Fille: 1485
2.Laroxyl: 1424
3.Plasmagby: 1374
4.Adam the first: 1367
5.Svertigo: 1336
6. Cashed: 1278
Week 2 coming up!
 

freezai

Live for the Applause
is a Tiering Contributor
Week 2

This little bug has the potential to be one of the scariest pokemon in LC. Coupled with water bubble, Dewpider has the strongest sheer power in the tier right behind Cranidos. It also has an interesting typing, being able to resist fighting and ground. However its not all gold for Dewpider, it struggles with a low speed stat and quite frankly lacks power on non water type attacks. How will you make this insect work? Perhaps a power oriented offense? Or maybe a bulky wall who still hits hard? The possibilties are relatively unexplored and its now time for you to explore!


This little mouse gopher thingy has gotten its claim to fame for being an extraordinary hail sweeper, in fact the only we've got in the tier. But Alolan Sandshrew is far from a one trick pony. Sandshrew has access to Rapid Spin and can beat the most common spin blocker Pumpkaboo. It appears to be that there are more options than just a one dimensional hail sweeper, maybe it can run an offensive rapid spin set, or perhaps a bulkier variant. Even if you do go the hail sweeper route, it has still has so much versatility regarding what set and moves that you can use. What set will it be captain?



A blast from the past with Croagunk is a nice change of pace this research week. Croagunk has always been in that class of really weird because it has such a nice movepool and great typing while unfortunately being straddled with a mediocre stat distribution. in ORAS, Croagunk utilized a number of sets ranging from NP to mixed attacker. However, in SUMO it is still up in the air about what set could be viewed as the best. Furthermore, the loss of Fletchling has improved Croagunk's viability (as it did too many fighting types). Will you build a NP croagunk so you can set up on all the fighting types everywhere? Or maybe you think that the mixed attacking set is still top dog? Or will you be the mastermind who comes up with something completely new?


As winner of Week 1, Fille has selected Alolan Diglett as a Research Week Pokemon. At first glance it is easy to dismiss him as a worse diglett, but it still has an interesting typing and great speed. It may very well be a worse diglett, but it would be unfair to the little guy to not search for some sort of niche before throwing him away. Put the steel typing to good word researchers!

OP is updated with mons and deadline, same rules as last week
 
Ooh looks like we have some more fun stuff this week.
PS Username: Joltage
Ladder Name: RW Jolt & RW Tage
Research Subjects: Alolan Sandshrew & Croagunk on each respective account

Opening thoughts and hypotheses:

As I head into this week, Alolan Sandshrew is a bit of an unknown for me. Its a new mon released this gen that I just haven't had the chance to really look at outside of a few games here and there, but never on my team. On paper, it looks to have potential as both a late-game cleaner and a mid-game wall breaker as Ice is generally one of the best types in the game offensively. Combining that with another decent STAB in its Steel typing, and its solid secondary coverage via Earthquake and you'll be hard pressed to find something that resists. Not only does Sandshrew have the movepool to put a hurtin on opposing teams, but with its ability Slush Rush, you'll be able to outspeed the entirety of the unboosted metagame as well as most scarfers.

But its not all good things for Sandshrew obviously; its Ice/Steel typing, while pretty decent offensively, leaves it with a 4x weakness to both Fire and Fighting types. And in a tier in which Fighting types are as dominant as they are in LC, that is not a good thing. On top of that, Sandshrew needs support to fully come online via Hail. This means that, unless Sandshrew itself is packing Hail in its moveset, one of Snover, Amaura, or Alolan Vulpix is required to be on the team with Sandshrew. Not only, does this severely restrict teambuilding, but the stacking of Ice types really doesn't help much defensively.

My research on Alolan Sandshrew will be conducted via the Gen7 Pokébank LC ladder on the account "RW Jolt". I am thinking I will start off trying to work Sandshrew in a traditional late-game cleaning role on a Hail Team. I will first be using an Eviolite variant to help bolster Sandshrew's naturally decent physical bulk, but unless I end up thoroughly blown away by this set, I will also try out a Life Orb set in a more wall breaking role. Additionally, I plan to test varying movesets across the week particularly looking at Icicle Crash vs Icicle Spear, Rapid Spin, Swords Dance, and whether Iron Head is actually essential or not, as I suspect it isn't. Toward the end of the week I may also test out using Sandshrew on a team without external Hail support and having Sandshrew in a less prominent role.

Overall, I expect Sandshrew to be an entirely solid mon in the LC tier, though the nature of weather teams lead me to think that the overarching success of Sandshrew will be heavily matchup oriented. Ultimately, the question I look to answer this week is whether or not Sandshrew can perform well enough and consistently enough to justify the amount of support it needs.



By contrast, Croagunk is anything but an unknown for me this week. Thanks to previous experiences with Croagunk, it is already my favorite 'glue mon' in the tier. Croagunk soft-checks so many threats in the tier including the ubiquitous fighting types of the tier, outside of the rare ZBH Scraggy and Pancham, as well as Pawinard, Fairy types, Carvanha, and most Shell Smashers; and this ability to be such a good blanket soft check to everything is one of the reasons I absolutely love using this mon. Croagunk is also super versatile in its set as it can opt for its popular mixed 4 attacks set, a fully special set, a fully physical set, nasty plot, and even a bulk up set.

Croagunk's issues in my past experiences mainly lie in the same places it excels. Croagunk often gets stretched too far throughout a battle and will find itself quickly worn down making it unable to check the things it needs to. In addition, Croagunk often falls victim to trapping, removing it before it gets a change to make an impact, though Gothita getting the boot this gen, certainly helps ease that pain. Lastly, Croagunk doesn't exactly hit hard and can thus be used as set up bait by threats such as Vullaby.

Research on Croagunk will be conducted on the Gen7 Pokébank LC ladder on the account "RW Tage". Because I already know and am confident in Croagunk's ability to function as a 'glue mon' in a team, I plan to explore his carry oriented options this week including the Nasty Plot and Bulk Up sets. With the Nasty Plot set, I will be testing out Focus Blast vs Dark Pulse to see which performs more consistently, and with the Bulk Up set, my primary focus will be on testing its general viability as I have no prior experience with the set.

Ultimately, the question with Croagunk this week will be whether or not it can function consistently and effectively enough to be made a primary option on a team. I am not confident that Croagunk will be able to achieve a level of performance I deem acceptable consistently enough for me to pursue utilizing it in this role over its usual utility sets.
 
PS:Allstar Line-up
Ladder: RW allstar 2
Mons: A-Dig+Croagunk
IT'S LIT AGAIN

Alolan Diglett and Croagunk are two mons that work pretty well together and if you use them correctly they could can destroy most voltturn teams which is really nice in lc

Pros. Alolan Diglett has a very nice niche in this meta which is disrupting mienfoo and chinchou voltturn and Magnemite volturn teams especially paired with Croagunk. It also can beat fairy's for Mienfoo, Timburr , Stufful, and Vullaby. Cons. Alolan diglett especially with the set i'm running is walled by Vullaby, Ferroseed, Phantump , Slowpoke, and mudbray basically any really bulky defensive that resits most of it's stab walls alolan diglett.


Pros.Croagunk is a very nice glue and hasn't really changed since gen 6 from just being a annoying anti meta pokemon that does tons of damage with the added fact of walling the shit out mareanie. Cons. With the introduction of mudbray Utility Croagunk is worse because the most it can do is knock it off and then switch into a appropriate counter.


https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pokebanklc-515413583 This replay showcases croagunk removing timburr for alolan diglett to kill the rest of his mons and mind games with croagunk and alolan diglett.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pokebanklc-515452798 in this replay it showcases the knock off support that Croagunk gives so alolan diglett can sweep.


Croagunk @ Eviolite
Ability: Dry Skin
Level: 5
EVs: 132 HP / 28 Atk / 116 Def / 108 SpA / 116 SpD
Quiet Nature
- Knock Off
- Sludge Bomb
- Vacuum Wave
- Drain Punch

Diglett-Alola @ Eviolite
Ability: Tangling Hair
Level: 5
EVs: 40 HP / 236 Atk / 36 Def / 196 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Sucker Punch
- Rock Slide

Ferroseed @ Eviolite
Ability: Iron Barbs
Level: 5
EVs: 84 HP / 36 Atk / 188 Def / 148 SpD / 36 Spe
Careful Nature
- Bullet Seed
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave
- Knock Off

Staryu @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
Level: 5
EVs: 196 HP / 156 Def / 156 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rapid Spin
- Scald
- Psychic
- Recover

Spritzee @ Eviolite
Ability: Aroma Veil
Level: 5
EVs: 212 HP / 196 Def / 12 SpA / 76 SpD / 12 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell
- Moonblast

Vullaby @ Eviolite
Ability: Overcoat
Level: 5
EVs: 116 HP / 76 Atk / 236 Def / 76 SpD
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Knock Off
- Brave Bird
- U-turn.


Conclusion- Alolan Diglett has a nice niche in gen 7 lc and Croagunk hasn't really changed since gen 6 but if you pair them together they can make and excellent team
 
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ps username: kektus
ladder name: rw kektus
research subject: alola sandshrew

my ladder ranking i might keep going if im not busy(i finished 20-6, lost 2 games that i was gonna win for sure from me disconnecting)

I used alola sandshrew as a hail sweeper. This is the set i used:

my chains froze (Sandshrew-Alola) @ Icium Z
Ability: Slush Rush
Level: 5
EVs: 236 Atk / 36 Def / 196 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Swords Dance

the ev set probably isnt perfect but whatever

moveset:My favorite part about this set is the icium z. I use the z move to set up a 2 hit kill on the pokemon(s) my opponent is using to stop my ice move spam (subzero slammer on ponyta switch in + eq kills a regular evio set) swords dance is really situational but has won me a few games. i used to run icicle spear over icicle crash but its just terrible.

i dont see alola sandshrew having a spot in the metagame outside of being a dps in hail, its typing is too trashy to be anything else.

THE BIGGEST PROBLEM with sandshrew a: unlike sun where the setters are different types (vulpix, cottonee, etc) or sand in XY (hippo is super bulky, and you have more space for other mons), hail teams rely on mons with terrible typings (vulpix, snover, amaura) I used vulpix, and snover as my snow setters. at that point 50% of my team was weak to fighting. snover can be played around really easily, vulpix's coverage is nonexistant, and amaura has a nice moveset but cant switch in on anything (all of them have terrible defensive typing to be fair)

sandshrew isnt easily played around, and hits his checks hard on switch in, but laddering with 3 ice types is like rolling a dice every time you press battle. i laddered with a diglett instead of a snover, but still got same if not worse results. Although i did go 20-6 (2 of my losses were due to a disconnection) i still dont feel like hail is a very reliable team archetype

real conclusion: investing so heavily into a hail core really weakens the defensive options in your team. even if you use 2 ice types (shrew + a setter), you still get owned by foo/timburr teams. snover helps to kill waters, vulpix is cool with icy rock, amaura sets rocks + has a nice moveset. sandshrew hits SUPER hard and its really easy to just insta win once you kill your opponent's check to him. i heavily reccomend that u use icium z because it has basically won me all of my games, otherwise id just get walled to death.

snow is pretty legit, but really matchup based. i expect to lose a lot more games once i get higher on the ladder if i have the time

meme conclusion: just use balance lol
 
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Fille

Afk
is a Pre-Contributor
LCPL Champion
PS Username: Fille
Ladder Username: RW Fille
Pokemon: Diglett-A



Will be updated during the weekend (More likely than not)

N Allstar you aint sniping me boi



Manbunlett (Diglett-Alola) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Force
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 Atk / 36 Def / 196 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide
- Sucker Punch

Set I ran for the whole week so far, was opting for Flash Cannon > Iron Head at some point but after thinking about it I realised Iron Head would still do more to Snubbull as no Snubbull is gonna come in on a steel type to get off an intimidate, no? At least no one has done that so far so we good.

Flood Horse (Hippopotas) (F) @ Eviolite
Ability: Sand Stream
Level: 5
EVs: 132 HP / 20 Atk / 212 Def / 100 SpD / 20 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Earthquake
- Yawn

Manbun (Diglett-Alola) (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Force
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 Atk / 36 Def / 196 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide
- Sucker Punch

Sumo (Vullaby) @ Eviolite
Ability: Overcoat
Level: 5
EVs: 196 HP / 236 Def / 76 SpD
Impish Nature
- Knock Off
- Brave Bird
- Roost
- U-turn

Rebel (Mienfoo) @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 5
EVs: 156 Atk / 36 Def / 36 SpD / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- High Jump Kick
- Drain Punch
- U-turn

SubwayDiet (Munchlax) (M) @ Eviolite
Ability: Thick Fat
Level: 5
EVs: 156 HP / 76 Atk / 116 Def / 160 SpD
Careful Nature
- Fire Punch
- Return
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Alarm Clock (Magnemite) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sturdy
Level: 5
EVs: 240 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 1 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 SpD
- Volt Switch
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ground]


So far I am honestly impressed with little ManBun Diglett. It's not just fashionable and trendy, it actually got a couple small niches > Diglett. The loss of 1 speed point is huge, and lack of Arena Trap hurts it's usefulness, but Sand Force is also a great ability if you have the right team. As I was running a Sand Team, Sand Force was the obvious choice for me, and it was quite a powerful pokemon with Sand Force, Life Orb and a Dual STAB both boosted by Sand Force. 19 speed tier was still good, but I missed safely killing Ponyta and Staryu. The added steel type was actually quite useful, giving it a nice neutral damage from grass instead of SE (See Cottonee) resistance to flying, fairy (!), Steel, 4x resistance to Rocks and immunity to Poison, while also keeping it's Electric immunity. The added Fighting weakness didn't really hurt it at all, as Diglett already struggled with Mienfoo/Timburr either way, allthough Vacuum Wave Croagunk could no longer be revengekilled which is kinda sad. I played the Diglett-A like you would a normal diglett, using Double switches, SlowTurn and it's immunities (And now good resistances) to get it in (relatively) safe. I could now use Diglett to take on Cottonees, switch in on annoying Snubbull Play Roughs (if really needed), Spritzee Moonblast, Archen Dual STAB (bait with Foo/Vullaby for my team usually) and even Grimer-A Gunk Shots if predicted correctly. The STAB Iron Head also helped alot vs. Fairy types, so while maybe not trapping, it could still deal huge amounts of damage with good STAB coverage + Rock Slide and Sucker Punch. Iron Head also was a good safe option for killing stuff if I suspected a ground immunity (like vullaby) might switch in, instead of risking let's say Rock Slide against a Mienfoo. Iron Head STAB was also great to have against Grass types, like Snivy, which is a huge threat and resists main STAB Earthquake.


Not compared to normal Diglett:
Pros:
  • Good Speed Tier (19)
  • Strong Dual STAB (Earthquake, Iron Head)
  • Lack of coverage moves are made up by having the neccessary ones (Sucker Punch and Rock Slide)
  • Sand Force makes it a viable Weather sweeper
  • 2 Immunities, Good resistances
  • Other viable moves (not tried yet tho) like Pursuit (lol), Memento, Shadow Claw (For Pump?), Substitute

Cons:
  • Mediocre Attack stat (Base 55, 15 with Jolly)
  • Poor coverage outside of moves mentioned above
  • Jox' testicles takes a Mach Punch (and literally any other move not resisted) better than Diglett-A
  • Weakness to the common Fighting type
  • Literally only 1 set that is viable (With a few variations like subbing in one of the moves mentioned above in)

Compared to normal Diglett:
Pros:
  • More Resistances and Immunities, granting it more chances to get in
  • STAB Iron Head
Cons:
  • Lacks Arena Trap, Diglett also gets Diglett-A's preferred ability (Sand Force)
  • 1 less speed (Base 90 v Base 95, 19 v 20)
  • Weak to Mach Punch/Vacuum Wave

Seeing that Diglett's viability is based on it's speed tier and ability, both of which Diglett-A lacks, comparing the two seems rather redundant, seeing as they will do very different jobs (While still being playing somewhat similarly due to their frailty and relatively high speed and low attack, + similar sets).


http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pokebanklc-514525236

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pokebanklc-514527948

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pokebanklc-515336216

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pokebanklc-516075900


These are the 4 most prominent replays, showing how Diglett-A would work in a game. More often than not it died on switch-in though, due to missprediction on my part sadly.


While Diglett-A is not a great mon (In all the ways that Diglett is), it did do it's job fairly well in my opinion, and still applied pressure to VoltTurn teams. It's currently residing in D rank Viability-wise, but I think moving it up to C- would be a good option. It still has an ok attack stat with LO, strong Dual STAB, Good Speed and Typing, and being an ok Sand Sweeper. This puts it above the rest of the D rank pokemons imo, and while not giving it a significant place in the current metagame, it can be utilised on very special teams, which is more than can be said of many other C- / C rank pokemons.
 
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freezai

Live for the Applause
is a Tiering Contributor
Congrats to this weeks winner Fille for his second consecutive victory, this time with a rating of 1572 and an impressive GXE of 86.1% He was able to use Alolan Diglett to great success and top the RW Leaderboard. Congrats!



Honorable mentions to All-Star Lineup (1564) and inscribe (1337) for coming in 2nd and 3rd respectively.

1. Fille: 1572
2. All-Star Lineup: 1564
3. Inscribe: 1337

Week 3 special coming up soon!
 

freezai

Live for the Applause
is a Tiering Contributor
Week 3
Z MOVE SPECIAL

Billy Mays here with a discount double check supreme mega offer limited to this week only!!! You get the wonderful opportunity to test drive any pokemon you want provided it has a Z move. Its as simple a 1 2 3. Take this opportunity to research different z move possibilites on a variety of mons. Maybe you'll make a good mon great with a z move set? Or perhaps you'll make a shitmon relevant? The possibilities are endless.
Chances are you're going to be changing your pokemon and idea quite often so for this week only, declaring your mon in the sign up post is not necessary.

*ps if I see you using darkinium Z cottonee i will personally stab you so that some creativity might get injected in your unoriginal ass n_n
http://www.serebii.net/sunmoon/zmoves.shtml this is helpful
Deadline 22nd January 11;59 pm est
 
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I suppose I should do my write up, so here goes.

Alright so basically I was a lot busier and less motivated to play than I expected to be at the start of the week, and thus, didn't even get around to Croagunk. But I can assure y'all Croagunk's great; go use it.


I also didn't use a whole lot of Alolan Sandshrew, but I used it enough to draw a few personal conclusions. The most important of those conclusions being that I just do not like using Alolan Sandshrew. Now don't get me wrong, it's a perfectly serviceable pokemon, it just didn't impress me in my games with it. The way the meta is, it feels like every team you face has something for it, be it a bulky water, a priority fighting type, or even an Abra (actually thinking about it, Gothita would have been a really good partner for this) It just felt like Sandshrew required too much support to function and even then wasn't able to carry a game on a consistent basis.

In my limited amount of playing with Sandshrew (only played 18 games total) I used this set:
Sandshrew-Alola @ Eviolite
Ability: Slush Rush
Level: 5
EVs: 36 HP / 236 Atk / 36 Def / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Icicle Spear
- Earthquake
- Swords Dance / Rapid Spin
The idea for this set was to either clean up late-game with Ice STAB or wallbreak mid-game using an SD. I chose to run dual Ice STAB because I could not think of a situation where I would rather use Iron Head over my Ice/Ground coverage, other than when up against a Snubbull, and Icicle Spear would give me the ability to punch through Abra (except when I only get two hits u_u) who otherwise could stop my sweep. Icicle Crash was there for when I needed solid consistent damage, and EQ is the best possible coverage move. For the last move I preferred SD to Rapid Spin because it allows Sandshrew to fulfill its primary role better. Rapid Spin, while nice from a utility standpoint didn't really mesh with Sandshrews role in the team.
 

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