Inheritance Inheritance (Magic Bounce and Good as Gold Banned!)

To those who struggle with Chien Pao, there's actually a way to not only reliably check it, but also render it harmless. :smogduck:
(
donor)
Iron Hands @ Bright Powder
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Defog
- Will-O-Wisp
- U-turn

Bright Powder (legal for some godforsaken reason) nerfs Triple Axel to a 74 BP average before Technician applies, and each Triple Axel hit will count for Flame Body, giving Iron Hands - assuming all hits connect - a 51% chance of burning Chien after two hits (weakening the last one) and a 65.7% chance after three hits. And once Chien is burned, it will no longer count for its own Beat Up, working in its disfavor. And let's just say Flame Body is dissuasive when it comes to clicking Knock against it.
The true "good" way to deal with Chien is the standard Intimidate/Fur Coat + Rocky Helmet set, but it's interesting to see how niche sets can be Chien's absolute nightmare.
This is a great check! I’ve also been able to reliably switch into it with this Primarina (Comfey) Triage set:
Primarina @ Leftovers
Ability: Triage
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Draining Kiss
- Giga Drain
- Stored Power

Triage is a bit quirky in this meta right now from what I can see. Definitely could be a problem but I haven’t had too much of a chance to play this new DLC2 meta with some of the new mons.

One counter to this set I’ve encountered is ironically a Chien Pao set, but it inherits from Tsareena instead of those technician sets. Queenly Majesty blocks Triage priority and its Dark typing makes it completely immune to Stored Power. Plus the Chien Pao I faced still had Triple Axel (and Knock Off too I think?) which still packed a punch.

This Primarina set is essentially worthless when faced with Queenly Majesty/Dazzling/Armor Tail mons with Psychic resist or immunity… but will inheriting mons with these abilities be worth taking up a whole slot on the team? I think so if Triage is here to stay.
 
:Chien-Pao:
Chien-Pao @ Wide Lens / Heavy Duty Boots
Ability: Technician
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Encore
- Tidy Up
- Triple Axel
- Knock Off

Another take on Technician Chien-Pao, this set functions as a late game cleaner. Encore stops setup sweepers, disrupts stall, and ultimately affords Chien more setup opportunities. Wide Lens effectively boosts the accuracy of Triple Axel to 99% and increases the average Base Power by x1.3... HDB is still probably better and allows Chien-Pao to function as secondary hazard removal.
 
Any particular reason? Offenses are pretty abysmal and it's really bad to inherit from (ability basically doesn't matter and only notable moves are p-shot and malignant chain)
I mean it says why in the ban post
Pecharunt is a ghost poison type with 160 defense and 88 in every other stat. The last thing this tier needs is an obsenely physically bulky ghost type that can also effectively run gholdengo as a donor. Hazard stack was already problematic with how limited removal was and it has not gotten any better, so we decided to not make it even worse with a super bulky ghost in the tier.
As an added point that probably doesn't matter as much
Pecharunt @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware / Magic Guard
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA (or 4 Def / 252 Spa Modest)
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast / Focus Blast
- Moonlight
This could be real and I hate it if it was
 
Any particular reason? Offenses are pretty abysmal and it's really bad to inherit from (ability basically doesn't matter and only notable moves are p-shot and malignant chain)
On paper at least, it's a extremely bulky spin blocker that can run practically any set that is already great on Gholdengo (some examples: :garganacl: :chimecho: :bramblin: :sinistcha: :skeledirge: :Espeon: :slowking-galar: :gholdengo: :Persian-alola: ... you get the point). I still think it should have been given a test run though.
 

SergioRules

||blimp||
is a Community Contributor
I've been playing this very sparingly since the first DLC dropped, been busy and haven't really had the time to build/try new things out. But I found the time today to throw some stuff together and I just gotta say I think this meta is very fun. Sure, there are some unbalanced aspects but I'm enjoying the games and exploring the new and returning mons. Just kinda posting my thoughts and echoing some that people have already said.

:chien-pao:@:ambipom:/:hitmontop: This mon with Technician Axel is kinda dummy, hate for this to be 5 posts in the past 24 hours about it, but it's really really good. I've been using two hard checks to it on each team and can still struggle sometimes depending on the set. But honestly my opinion comes from me using it rather than playing against it, specifically the Ambipom set for Beat Up too. If opponents don't have a solid ice resist it just wins. One game I even Knocked the opposing Toxapex, pivoted out and was able to 2HKO with Axel it when it came back in. Again, I don't know if it's necessarily broken but I'm kind of leaning towards that way.
:primarina:@:comfey: I started putting this mon on my teams as a Chien-Pao check, but soon realized that it is an extremely good sweeper in its own right. Triage Draining Kiss can clean games super easily and Stored Power deals with most Unaware walls. I've been preferring Synthesis as a 4th move over something like Giga Drain just for the reliability. The Fairy type is also SUPER useful since Cyclizar inheritors can't switch you out or really touch you at all and you can just get to +6 on them for free and it checks the ever present :roaringmoon:@:meowscarada: that everyone and t.heir mom has been running on ladder. Feels much easier to check than Pao because of how weak Draining Kiss's base power is, but it's so easy to set up with this mon that I could see it becoming problematic though it's probably more of a Triage problem than a Primarina problem.
:snorlax:@:lucario: While not necessarily a new threat, SD Espeed Lax has been doing super great work for me recently. People seem to be undervaluing Indeedee inheritors, likely due to how prevalent Chien-Pao is.I've seen some other Espeed users but I like lax the best because of its great bulk so when you have to go for a Crunch/Drain Punch you can pretty easily.

Some other fun mons that I haven't used but am looking to try out
:gougingfire: Not sure what I want to have this inherit from, :dragonite::kommo-o::flygon::scrafty: all seem like they have some very fun and cool abilities while having access to both Fire and Dragon STAB and Dragon Dance. I also lowkey think that :salazzle: could be a good donor with Fire Lash as the STAB to snowball further.
:ragingbolt: Has a very wide array of donors, basically anything that gets Tbolt and has something unique. :latias:/:latios: for Levitate+recovery, :rampardos: for SFLO, :dragalge: for clicking buttons, and I think :cyclizar: could be in consideration if you aren't already using one.
:ironboulder: The only thing I can think of for this guy is running :arcaninehisui: for the Rock Head Head Smash or :lycanrocdusk: for Tough Claws stuff. I would've loved to see this inherit from :kleavor: but TIL homeboy doesn't get Psycho Cut.
:ironcrown::latios::latias: Grouping these together bc I think people will just start using them as Indeedee inheritors but I'm sure they could do so much more. I haven't quite figured out what that is yet, but Stored Power is everywhere so I'm sure there'll be something.
:keldeo: Mega Launcher is back, drop your Darkrais and say hello to the real one. Just kidding, Darkrai is stronger and faster, Keldeo's only niche is having more STABs and only slightly better bulk. Only worth if you REALLY want to use Keldeo.

I have some other ideas but I wanna keep them under wraps for now. I think Chien-Pao is a big problem and I would love action to be taken on it but in the meantime I'm going to absolutely abuse it fully on every team I can.
 
Been on a bit of a hiatus but I'm back and ready to share some silly stuff I've been trying on ladder :) (also RIP Pecharunt)

The current team I'm running, still tweaking it though! I will keep trying to run stall and you cannot stop me >:)

:iron hands: @ :talonflame:
Iron Hands @ Leftovers
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- U-turn
- Roost
- Temper Flare
- Will-O-Wisp

Yeah, I stole this. It's good, like REALLY GOOD. It eats physical hits for days, generates incredible tempo with Uturn and threatens a lot of physical mons (especially all the Chien-Paos running around) with Flame Body and Wilo. I'm still toying around with Temper Flare vs Brave Bird vs Defog vs ?? since it's nice to be able to still apply pressure and hit hard since this IS Iron Hands we're talking about- and I don't like it just being a flame body meatbag.

:ting-lu: @ :cyclizar:
Ting-Lu @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Knock Off
- Dragon Tail
- Rapid Spin
- U-turn

Disgustingly physically bulky rapid spinner. Idk, I see a lot of things like Archaludon, Goodra, and quite a few others but I just really like using Ting as my Cyclizar inheritor. Knock hits really hard and is great utility, Dragon Tail and Spin and Uturn- like what do you want me to say lol it's Cyclizar, the most brainless plug and play 4 move slots you could ask for (and I love it for that). Realistically could use SpD and an AV or Boots, but I'm addicted to Ronky Helmet.

:blissey: @ :clefable:
Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Night Shade
- Wish
- Protect
- Stealth Rock

Unga bunga special sweepers ain't got jack on Blissey (until they run Psyshock then it's joever) but yeah. It wish passes kinda, sets up rocks and then just spams Night Shade. Not flashy, but it's been working as a special wall for me.

:great tusk: @ :garganacl:
Great Tusk @ Leftovers
Ability: Purifying Salt
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Salt Cure
- Body Press
- Recover
- Iron Defense

Prob alongside Hands the best member of the team. Thing devours physical attackers, does incredible amounts of damage and is a setup threat with ID. Salt Cure is a no-counter move as well, just a great mon. A status immunity is also REALLY handy for the team.

:basculegion-f: @ :gholdengo:
Basculegion-F (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Good as Gold
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Recover
- Nasty Plot
- Thunder Wave

This is when I started COOKING! I wanted a ghost type with GaG, and experimented with Sini-something, Annihilape, and a few others but I landed on Bascu-F. It's got decent enough bulky, water typing is really nice to have and of course the beauty of GaG+Ghost. Honestly, Gholdengo itself is prob just better but I liked cooking with this.

:coalossal: @ :Clodsire:
Coalossal @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Water Absorb
Tera Type: Rock
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 28 Spe
- Rock Slide
- Recover
- Spikes
- Toxic

WE'RE BACK TO GEN 8 GODLY GIFT WITH THIS ONE LADS. Oh my god this has been such a treat to have as a throwback, MAN I loved that metagame and Coalossal was my trump card. Anywho, this is basically an "I HATE IRON MOTH BAN IT PLEASE PLEASE" because I got 6-0 swept by someone literally just clicking funny fire move on a sun team with it WAY too many times, and it's just so tilting. When Max SpD Blissey is taking 60% from a special move that has 0 drawbacks is when I start cooking. Anywho this thing still gets clapped by those running Ninetales+Scorching Sands, but Blissey handles those sets well anyways. Now, for those of you running Moth+Walking Wake? Yeah. You know who you are. The coal is ready to start spike stacking on you, spreading toxic and laughing as I'm essentially immune to your Fire/Water combo. Oh, and the few times I see things like Barraskewda is funny getting walled by Santa's Deluxe Present.

Ranting aside this has been a fun team to cook, unfortunately been a bit occupied and I'm not too big a fan of many of the DLC mons so we'll see where we go from here! Inheritance has actually been feeling pretty fun to play so I'll try and make some more goofy stall sets :)
 

Don Vascus

Certified Wednesday Poster
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
It seems Chi-Yu is missing from the banlist at the beginning of the thread (either that or it's an issue with the validator, but I have a sneaking suspicion it's probably not meant to be legal)
View attachment 593460
I think you're just assuming chi yu has more moves than what you think it actually has


Darkrai has a weird issue in that its super unflexible with it's sets mainly because Clawitzer!Darkrai eclipes all the competition

:clawitzer: :darkrai:
Clawitzer (Darkrai) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Mega Launcher
Tera Type: Water
- Dark Pulse
- Aura Sphere
- Sludge Bomb / Flash Cannon
- U-turn

Like yeah, Porygon Z has adaptability+ Nasty Plot, but why would i run that when I can just use the set that gives me a 120 BP stab move AND a 120 bp fighting move to hit the most common Av Regen in the tier + Tinglu. The ability and those two moves alone eclipes 99% percent of sets you could maybe try with nasty plot or some other coverage, but this set isn't perfect. So once you see that you like those two big stupid moves you look at Clawitzer's movepool and you might notice that it doesn't learn any setup and it doesn't have any coverage for fighting types, which means the only other moves worth running in the last slots are U-turn, and A move to hit fairies, the choice coming down to if you think primarina or fezandipiti is more likely to switch on you. You cant sleep on this set. If you lack a really bulky specially defensive mon or something to stop it from clicking for free you can easily loose the game in turn 9. Its damage is insane and its faster than most mons in the tier. Always a mon to keep in mind


To compete with Clawitzer on Darkrai you have to have a boosted stab AND boosted coverage, and thats surpringly very rare for dark types. Like there's no Sheer Force mon that learns dark pulse right now because they're all dexited. But there is one:

:chi yu: :darkrai:
Chi-Yu (Darkrai) @ Life Orb
Ability: Beads of Ruin
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Psychic
- Fire Blast

Chi yu gives darkrai a broken ability in beads of ruin, a strong setup move, a move to hit metal hariyamas with in Psychic, and a fourth move in Fire Blast, which is your highest damage against Tinglu. And thats it

Yeah uhh Chi yu's special movepool looks like this
Screenshot_20240117-020323-386.png


So it only learns the special fire moves every fire type learns, psychic, dark type super fang, and dark pulse. As a result of that even with its stupid ability you can struggle to break stuff like Av mons and what not. It still darkrai however, so with that mon removed you can probably just win even more than with Clawitzer bc you can actually change moves. This needs more support but it can definitely find its place in Hyper offense cores for example

So yeah im assume that you were not aware that chi yu has an actually awful movepool, which is why it is not banned and probably why your mystery set did not validate

Ps: Stop using Sheer Force Darkrai, Its terrible. You're better off using Jolteon because it actually has a stab
 
As said a couple posts ago, it's probably best to post your whole set because there could potentially be an error in your set rather than something wrong with the validator.
There seems to be a issue with inheriting from Gouging Fire and Iron Boulder specifically. I tried to validate this team
Terrakion @ Booster Energy
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Rock
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Mighty Cleave
- Close Combat
- Throat Chop
- Swords Dance

Garchomp @ Booster Energy
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Flare Blitz

Darkrai @ Life Orb
Ability: Beads of Ruin
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Psychic
- Nasty Plot
- Overheat
And it says that Terrakion and Garchomp's sets are "illegal", while Darkrai passes without issues. Playing around with their IVs does not seem to solve the problem. Even GF/IB aren't allowed to "inherit" from themselves, but they can from other Pokemon. Inheriting from Raging Bolt also works normally.
 

Don Vascus

Certified Wednesday Poster
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
There seems to be a issue with inheriting from Gouging Fire and Iron Boulder specifically. I tried to validate this team
Terrakion @ Booster Energy
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Rock
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Mighty Cleave
- Close Combat
- Throat Chop
- Swords Dance

Garchomp @ Booster Energy
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance
- Flare Blitz

Darkrai @ Life Orb
Ability: Beads of Ruin
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Psychic
- Nasty Plot
- Overheat
And it says that Terrakion and Garchomp's sets are "illegal", while Darkrai passes without issues. Playing around with their IVs does not seem to solve the problem. Even GF/IB aren't allowed to "inherit" from themselves, but they can from other Pokemon. Inheriting from Raging Bolt also works normally.
Are the lame bootleg terrakion and entei with a crown event only pokemon?
 
New tech dropped! Me and bake lando were theory crafting last night and they introduced me to something absolutely silly, and I think a super anti-meta pick, as well as us creating an absolutely out of pocket 0 counterplay counter to said mons biggest counter- I'd like to introduce you all to Iron Crown!

:sv/iron crown:

:iron crown: @ :reuniclus:
Iron Crown @ Leftovers/Life Orb/Colbur Berry
Ability: Magic Guard
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Psyshock/Psychic Noise
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Flash Cannon/Focus Blast

So, lets get into the sauce of why Crown is absolutely disgusting. The main thing is this man has BULK, it can eat a surprising amount of hits, has magic guard so hazard spam and SALT CURE doesn't effect it. Alongside being a steel that isn't weak to Body Press, this gives it massive amounts of switch in oppurtunities. It also has solid speed, outspeeding a number of threats, Tusk being the main one. While it admittedly I find has trouble against some faster hard hitting offensive mons like Roaring Moon, it is one of THE hardest counters to stall and comfey inheritors in the game.

Let's look at the movepool and discuss it a bit. Recover and Calm Mind are basically mandatory, but the other 2 are up in the air in my opinion. Bake Lando used Psyshock exclusively when I was testing this with them, though I'm theorycrafting Psychic Noise as a more versatile option that allows it to still beat special walls like Blissey while ALSO heavily threatening the 2 big physical walls in Tusk and Hands. Flash Cannon and Focus Blast is up to you in my opinion, Cannon is reliable STAB to help you not tear through your Psy PP, whereas Focus Miss allows you to heavily threaten Moon on the switch in or other darks. But we're forgetting something, aren't we?

Now, on close inspection you may think 'wait a minute, doesn't this just uber lose to the most common special wall Hoodra/Cyclizar?' YES. However~ me and bake cooked up a really shiesty team member that Hoodra users will have genuinely no way to outplay.


:sv/gholdengo:

:gholdengo: @ :weezing-galar:

Gholdengo @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Pain Split/Rest
- Will-O-Wisp/Toxic/Toxic Spikes/Taunt
- Toxic Spikes/Defog

This... thing. This unholy abomination, a crime against nature itself. Now, let me preface this- I despise the state of hazards right now in Inheritance, I think Gholdengo, or rather Good as Gold being free is contributing to a very unhealthy metagame- but this puts a smile on my face. Now, let's go over why this thing absolutely destroys any chance of a Hoodra user being able to check Crown. First off, Gas allows it to disable its regen, and because Crown will always outspeed Hoodra, you always will get the first switch, meaning you ALWAYS get to disable Hoodra's regen. You also are a ghost and steel type, meaning you resist Uturn and DTail, immune to its rapid spin, and Colbur will make its first knock off hurt a little less. You also threaten it with wisp, have pseudo recovery in Pain Split or Rest, can setup Tspikes, Taunt, Defog, quite a few options shockingly- as well as Shadow Ball for STAB! Hoodra CANNOT threaten you in any meaningful way, meanwhile you can disable its damage with Wisp, can Defog hazards away while having STAB SBall for opposing GaG users (who tf runs a non-ghost GaG mon?), genuinely the only thing this is missing is reliable recovery. Combined with Crown, this makes for a hilarious core where Crown's biggest counter cannot even function properly.

Side note because I do want to rant about this, I feel GaG should be banned or restricted because, from my games the state of most matches is who can stack up hazards first, and/or who can disable the opponent's GaG mon first. It's less about the pokemon and more spike stacking carrying every single team that isn't mono boots. If we banned GaG as well, mons like Pecharunt getting preemptive bans because we don't want the hazard stacking metagame to be even WORSE would be, for the most part fixed. As it stands I find hazards to be way too dominating of a presence in every single match due to Good as Gold's presence, and the metagame would be far healthier without it.

Lastly, I want to hugely thank bake lando for theory crafting this! They're who introduced me to the hilarity of Iron Crown and I think it's a shame I don't see Poorly Named Cobalion more. Cheers, and take care everyone :) happy hunting!

EDIT: GUYS NEW INFO DROPPED! Just realized that Psychic Noise straight up just DISABLES draining moves like Draining Kiss- time to start slotting in Psychic Noise to counter Comfey users!
 
Last edited:
Side note because I do want to rant about this, I feel GaG should be banned or restricted because, from my games the state of most matches is who can stack up hazards first, and/or who can disable the opponent's GaG mon first. It's less about the pokemon and more spike stacking carrying every single team that isn't mono boots. If we banned GaG as well, mons like Pecharunt getting preemptive bans because we don't want the hazard stacking metagame to be even WORSE would be, for the most part fixed. As it stands I find hazards to be way too dominating of a presence in every single match due to Good as Gold's presence, and the metagame would be far healthier without it.
The burden of proof to ban GaG simply is not high enough because hardly anyone uses it on ladder. This is mostly due to Gholdengo having a movepool that is really only suited to Gholdengo and awkward for other 'mons to inherit. Aside from that, Ghold doesn't really fulfill any utility aside from being a (very stoppable) setup sweeper. Lastly, there are unstoppable methods of hazard clearance (Tidy Up, Court Change), that have become increasingly popular as an adaptation to the hazards meta.

If GaG was as broken as you say it is, then it would be spammed on high ladder to great success the same way that Technician Chien-Pao/Weavile, Comfey, and Sun are. In my opinion, these are the current threats that have the greatest impact on the game and are the most ban-worthy.
 
:sv/gholdengo:

:gholdengo: @ :weezing-galar:

Gholdengo @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Pain Split/Rest
- Will-O-Wisp/Toxic/Toxic Spikes/Taunt
- Toxic Spikes/Defog
as someone who bakes landos often, i must put in my 2 cents here. extensive and extremely high iq theorycrafting has led me to this even more disgusting set designed for stallbreaking but also just generally being annoying.

Gholdengo @ Covert Cloak
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 56 HP / 136 Def / 252 SpA / 64 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Pain Split
- Will-O-Wisp
- Substitute

this set is designed to be annoying to specifically regen hoodra/goodra/ting-lu, blissey, garg tusk/hands, and nothing else. spamming wisp is really funny because nothing can switch into it except iron moth in which case you may gracefully forfeit. 56/136 phys evs minimizes hp while allowing its sub to live an itemless knock from the aforementioned regens after a burn. 64 spe ev's allow it to outspeed both 4 spe moltres and gouging fire so you can put more pressure on an opponent with shadow ball. having ngas in general allows it to pressure psalt and magic guard users that would otherwise not be taking any chip (or halved damage from shadow ball in garg's case). basically this is metagaming on a different level because it's preparing for threats that do not yet exist. truly an ascendent iq play.

thanks again to Mywookiearmy for spreading the iron crown propaganda. Insanely goated mon
 
New tech dropped! Me and bake lando were theory crafting last night and they introduced me to something absolutely silly, and I think a super anti-meta pick, as well as us creating an absolutely out of pocket 0 counterplay counter to said mons biggest counter- I'd like to introduce you all to Iron Crown!

:sv/iron crown:

:iron crown: @ :reuniclus:
Iron Crown @ Leftovers/Life Orb/Colbur Berry
Ability: Magic Guard
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Psyshock/Psychic Noise
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Flash Cannon/Focus Blast

So, lets get into the sauce of why Crown is absolutely disgusting. The main thing is this man has BULK, it can eat a surprising amount of hits, has magic guard so hazard spam and SALT CURE doesn't effect it. Alongside being a steel that isn't weak to Body Press, this gives it massive amounts of switch in oppurtunities. It also has solid speed, outspeeding a number of threats, Tusk being the main one. While it admittedly I find has trouble against some faster hard hitting offensive mons like Roaring Moon, it is one of THE hardest counters to stall and comfey inheritors in the game.

Let's look at the movepool and discuss it a bit. Recover and Calm Mind are basically mandatory, but the other 2 are up in the air in my opinion. Bake Lando used Psyshock exclusively when I was testing this with them, though I'm theorycrafting Psychic Noise as a more versatile option that allows it to still beat special walls like Blissey while ALSO heavily threatening the 2 big physical walls in Tusk and Hands. Flash Cannon and Focus Blast is up to you in my opinion, Cannon is reliable STAB to help you not tear through your Psy PP, whereas Focus Miss allows you to heavily threaten Moon on the switch in or other darks. But we're forgetting something, aren't we?

Now, on close inspection you may think 'wait a minute, doesn't this just uber lose to the most common special wall Hoodra/Cyclizar?' YES. However~ me and bake cooked up a really shiesty team member that Hoodra users will have genuinely no way to outplay.


:sv/gholdengo:

:gholdengo: @ :weezing-galar:

Gholdengo @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Neutralizing Gas
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Pain Split/Rest
- Will-O-Wisp/Toxic/Toxic Spikes/Taunt
- Toxic Spikes/Defog

This... thing. This unholy abomination, a crime against nature itself. Now, let me preface this- I despise the state of hazards right now in Inheritance, I think Gholdengo, or rather Good as Gold being free is contributing to a very unhealthy metagame- but this puts a smile on my face. Now, let's go over why this thing absolutely destroys any chance of a Hoodra user being able to check Crown. First off, Gas allows it to disable its regen, and because Crown will always outspeed Hoodra, you always will get the first switch, meaning you ALWAYS get to disable Hoodra's regen. You also are a ghost and steel type, meaning you resist Uturn and DTail, immune to its rapid spin, and Colbur will make its first knock off hurt a little less. You also threaten it with wisp, have pseudo recovery in Pain Split or Rest, can setup Tspikes, Taunt, Defog, quite a few options shockingly- as well as Shadow Ball for STAB! Hoodra CANNOT threaten you in any meaningful way, meanwhile you can disable its damage with Wisp, can Defog hazards away while having STAB SBall for opposing GaG users (who tf runs a non-ghost GaG mon?), genuinely the only thing this is missing is reliable recovery. Combined with Crown, this makes for a hilarious core where Crown's biggest counter cannot even function properly.

Side note because I do want to rant about this, I feel GaG should be banned or restricted because, from my games the state of most matches is who can stack up hazards first, and/or who can disable the opponent's GaG mon first. It's less about the pokemon and more spike stacking carrying every single team that isn't mono boots. If we banned GaG as well, mons like Pecharunt getting preemptive bans because we don't want the hazard stacking metagame to be even WORSE would be, for the most part fixed. As it stands I find hazards to be way too dominating of a presence in every single match due to Good as Gold's presence, and the metagame would be far healthier without it.

Lastly, I want to hugely thank bake lando for theory crafting this! They're who introduced me to the hilarity of Iron Crown and I think it's a shame I don't see Poorly Named Cobalion more. Cheers, and take care everyone :) happy hunting!
i had also tried something similar to that crown set in the past,i can say that mglo makes that crown hit like a truck
 
i had also tried something similar to that crown set in the past,i can say that mglo makes that crown hit like a truck
What was the set you used, because I've tried importing the set from mywookiearmy, but it says it's illegal, I'm assuming for the same unknown reason as the earlier Iron Boulder issue
 
What was the set you used, because I've tried importing the set from mywookiearmy, but it says it's illegal, I'm assuming for the same unknown reason as the earlier Iron Boulder issue
unfortunately i deleted that team as it was mostly just random mons thrown together, outside of the mglo crown set nothing was really workin that well,also yeah, i think there may be a with that
 
The BEATles
#1 Ladder Team (1554 Elo)

:Chien-Pao::Metagross::Roaring Moon::Ting-Lu::Iron Hands::Azelf:

This team was built around the move Beat Up - and two specific abilities (Technician, Toxic Chain) that exploit this move to its maximum potential.

The first thing you'll notice about this team is the high base attack stat of all party members - this is by design, as Beat Up's damage calculation is based on the attack stat of all party members. This team configuration results in a Beat Up that is 107 BP / 100% ACC.

The net effect for my two abusers:
  • :Chien-Pao: In addition to a Technician-boosted 180 BP Triple Axel, Chien has a 160 BP dark-type STAB as well
  • :Roaring Moon: Roaring Moon's 107 BP Beat Up has an 88% chance of badly poisoning the target
Now, for the rest of the team...

The Comfey Counter
  • :Azelf: Switches directly into :Primarina: / :Hatterene: (INH:Comfey:) and prevents any form of healing or attack (aside from 20BP Stored Power). Then I can freely switch back to either of my dark-type breaks and continue breaking. I chose Azelf over the more popular :Choice Specs::Deoxys-Speed:because Azelf's 120 ATK stat boosts the power of Beat Up.
The Great Wall + Anti-Sun core
  • :Ting-Lu::Metagross: Sun is broken in the current meta - in response, there's been a shift towards using AV water-types or regular Goodra over it's Hisui variant; alternatively, you can pair a traditional AV Regen wall with a Fire-immune Steel-type as counter-play. Metagross is also a secondary check to Comfey if I unexpectedly lose my Azelf in the early-game.
You might need a Fur Coat
  • :Iron Hands: Blanket physical wall, counters opposing Chien-Pao. Importantly, has a 140 ATK stat to beef up the base power of Beat Up

1705885862820.png

Post-DLC 2 Thoughts
Get rid of these :Chien-Pao::Weavile: or these :Hitmontop::Cinccino::Ambipom:
  • 252 Atk Choice Band Technician Chien-Pao Triple Axel (40 BP) (3 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kingambit: 177-210 (51.9 - 61.5%) -- approx. 2HKO
^ bc wtf is that


:Heat Rock: needs to go imo - while persistently underutilized by the player base, Sun presents ridiculous challenges when team building and players are forced to run objectively garbage shit (like Flash Fire Metagross) to counter it.
  • 252 SpA Choice Specs Protosynthesis Iron Moth Weather Ball (100 BP Fire) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra-Hisui in Sun: 183-216 (50.2 - 59.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
^ bruh moment


:Comfey: not as "broken" per se... but something like ~70% of the top setup sweepers are weak to fairy-type moves and the prevalence Comfey renders them absolutely cucked. idk if enjoyability of gameplay matters to tier leadership when it comes to banning things, but comfey definitely makes the game less fun/interesting to play for me personally.
 
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The BEATles
#1 Ladder Team (1554 Elo)

:Chien-Pao::Metagross::Roaring Moon::Ting-Lu::Iron Hands::Azelf:

This team was built around the move Beat Up - and two specific abilities (Technician, Toxic Chain) that exploit this move to its maximum potential.

The first thing you'll notice about this team is the high base attack stat of all party members - this is by design, as Beat Up's damage calculation is based on the attack stat of all party members. This team configuration results in a Beat Up that is 107 BP / 100% ACC.

The net effect for my two abusers:
  • :Chien-Pao: In addition to a Technician-boosted 180 BP Triple Axel, Chien has a 160 BP dark-type STAB as well
  • :Roaring Moon: Roaring Moon's 107 BP Beat Up has an 88% chance of badly poisoning the target
Now, for the rest of the team...

The Comfey Counter
  • :Azelf: Switches in directly to Primarina (INH:Comfey:) and prevents any form of healing or attack (aside from 20BP Stored Power). Then I can freely switch back to either of my dark-type breaks and continue breaking. I chose Azelf over the more popular :Choice Specs::Deoxys-Speed: because Azelf's 120 ATK state boosts the power of Beat Up.
The Great Wall + Anti-Sun core
  • :Ting-Lu::Metagross: Sun is broken in the current meta - in response, there's been a shift towards using AV water-types or regular Goodra over it's Hisui variant; alternatively, you can pair a traditional AV Regen wall with a Fire-immune Steel-type as counter-play. Metagross is also a secondary check to Comfey if I unexpectedly lose my Azelf in the early-game.
You might need a Fur Coat
  • :Iron Hands: Blanket physical wall, counters opposing Chien-Pao. Importantly, has a 140 ATK stat to beef up the base power of Beat Up


Post-DLC 2 Thoughts
Get rid of these :Chien-Pao::Weavile: or these :Hitmontop::Cinccino::Ambipom:
  • 252 Atk Choice Band Technician Chien-Pao Triple Axel (40 BP) (3 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kingambit: 177-210 (51.9 - 61.5%) -- approx. 2HKO
^ bc wtf is that


:Heat Rock: needs to go imo - while persistently underutilized by the player base, Sun presents ridiculous challenges when team building and players are forced to run objectively garbage shit (like Flash Fire Metagross) to counter it.
  • 252 SpA Choice Specs Protosynthesis Iron Moth Weather Ball (100 BP Fire) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra-Hisui in Sun: 183-216 (50.2 - 59.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
^ bruh moment


:Comfey: not as "broken" per se... but something like ~70% of the top setup sweepers are weak to fairy-type moves and the prevalence Comfey renders them absolutely cucked. idk if enjoyability of gameplay matters to tier leadership when it comes to banning things, but comfey definitely makes the game less fun/interesting to play for me personally.
Sick team (outside of Chien-Lmao:woo:) and I gotta get around to trying Persian-A on things, seems super fun.

As for bans personally I'd rather have the Technitrio get banned than the weasels, though I wouldn't cry if either or got banned.
Sun 100% agree with needing the ban hammer,

252 SpA Choice Specs Protosynthesis Iron Moth Weather Ball (100 BP Fire) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey in Sun: 295-348 (41.3 - 48.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

it's so unhinged. MAYBE, and though I'd much rather Drought be banned, MAYBE Moth could be banned instead, either way I'm sick of seeing it everywhere and having it unga bunga its way through teams with a shocking amount of sets all things considered. I am resorting to running mfing SpD Coalossal because of sun, COALOSSAL (high iq sleeper threat I swear).

Lastly, and I'm a stall player so I'm prob biased, I don't struggle much with Comfeys but I imagine its a far harder matchup for offense. I sit on the fence, don't really care either way. Amazing analysis and team! :)
 

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