I would rather have Ogerpon-Hearthflame be voted for quickban, rather than theorizing about ranking it in VR. It doesn't seem very healthy for the meta
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Resource National Dex Viability Rankings
- Thread starter Kyo
- Start date
Nah lets have a suspect test so I can assemble the DNB community to come thru for my boi ogo
then the tier would be pointless to play
A tier like Natdex being centralized is worse than OU. I hope y'all know what you're doing. It's already ruined by tera as is
Kenpwnchi
formerly Pwndkthnx
I can agree with the centralizing being worse in NatDex, but I can't say it's being ruined by Tera Type. In fact, I still think Tera Type is, arguably, the BEST PKMN mechanic to ever to exist (aside from Mega Evolutions [And MAYBE Z-Moves]).
Lycanroc-dusk to C
Rex (Lycanroc-Dusk) (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Tough Claws
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Accelerock
- Fire Fang
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
Lycanroc hit very hard with choice band, and has powerful priority in accelerock. I've had alot of success with this set, as it 2hkoes a majority of the metagame.
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Fire Fang vs. 252 HP / 116 Def Gholdengo: 238-282 (62.9 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Garganacl: 376-444 (93 - 109.9%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 448-528 (116 - 136.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Fire Fang vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 308-364 (87.5 - 103.4%) -- 25% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 282-332 (80.1 - 94.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Great Tusk: 187-221 (50.4 - 59.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Accelerock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tornadus-Therian: 288-338 (96.3 - 113%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Lycanroc-Dusk Stone Edge vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Gliscor: 187-222 (53.1 - 63%) -- 80.1% chance to 2HKO after Poison Heal thats crazy ngl, physdef does wall it tho, but the point is it can't switch in.
252 Atk Choice Band Lycanroc-Dusk Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 121-144 (39.8 - 47.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO physdef pex is able to wall it but lycan does 2hko spdef pex.
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Tera Fighting Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 219-258 (54.2 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
These calcs show how well it matches up vs most of the meta. It best serves as a late-game cleaner where the moment everything is chipped it can expect to wreak havoc if you predict right,
Until you notice that lycanroc doesnt ohko much. Thats because in most cases you would switch something like tusk or pex in and expect it to switch but instead it hits you with a powerful cc/stone edge.
Lycanroc-dusk with CB is very prediction reliant, and if you make the wrong play you might give the opponent a chance to attack you and ko something or just giving them momentum. However, if you play right your rewarded in alot of damage against the opponent. it also faces competition from zamazenta as an offensive pokemon. But accelerock does have its uses.
This isn't a meta-defining pokemon for sure however it does have its niches and thats why I think it should be in C tier.
edit: Lycanroc also just destroys our good friend ogerpon-hearthflame so just another reason to rank it.
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Accelerock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Ogerpon-Hearthflame: 272-324 (90.3 - 107.6%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
replays:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1956498604-ed26ej76araear372ihftv7hl55a01mpw this shows lycanrocs potential as a wallbreaker and cleaner.
Ill get more replays soon, dw.
Rex (Lycanroc-Dusk) (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Tough Claws
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Accelerock
- Fire Fang
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
Lycanroc hit very hard with choice band, and has powerful priority in accelerock. I've had alot of success with this set, as it 2hkoes a majority of the metagame.
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Fire Fang vs. 252 HP / 116 Def Gholdengo: 238-282 (62.9 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Garganacl: 376-444 (93 - 109.9%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 448-528 (116 - 136.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Fire Fang vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 308-364 (87.5 - 103.4%) -- 25% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 282-332 (80.1 - 94.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Great Tusk: 187-221 (50.4 - 59.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Accelerock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tornadus-Therian: 288-338 (96.3 - 113%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Lycanroc-Dusk Stone Edge vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Gliscor: 187-222 (53.1 - 63%) -- 80.1% chance to 2HKO after Poison Heal thats crazy ngl, physdef does wall it tho, but the point is it can't switch in.
252 Atk Choice Band Lycanroc-Dusk Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 121-144 (39.8 - 47.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO physdef pex is able to wall it but lycan does 2hko spdef pex.
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Tera Fighting Lycanroc-Dusk Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tangrowth: 219-258 (54.2 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
These calcs show how well it matches up vs most of the meta. It best serves as a late-game cleaner where the moment everything is chipped it can expect to wreak havoc if you predict right,
Until you notice that lycanroc doesnt ohko much. Thats because in most cases you would switch something like tusk or pex in and expect it to switch but instead it hits you with a powerful cc/stone edge.
Lycanroc-dusk with CB is very prediction reliant, and if you make the wrong play you might give the opponent a chance to attack you and ko something or just giving them momentum. However, if you play right your rewarded in alot of damage against the opponent. it also faces competition from zamazenta as an offensive pokemon. But accelerock does have its uses.
This isn't a meta-defining pokemon for sure however it does have its niches and thats why I think it should be in C tier.
edit: Lycanroc also just destroys our good friend ogerpon-hearthflame so just another reason to rank it.
252 Atk Choice Band Tough Claws Lycanroc-Dusk Accelerock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Ogerpon-Hearthflame: 272-324 (90.3 - 107.6%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
replays:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1956498604-ed26ej76araear372ihftv7hl55a01mpw this shows lycanrocs potential as a wallbreaker and cleaner.
Ill get more replays soon, dw.
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your replays don't workLycanroc-dusk to C
alright ill fix them.your replays don't work
yeah I agree tera is the best generational mechanic if you don't count the other 2 better generational mechanics
also, to stop this from being a oneliner,
from A to A+I feel like gliscor getting spikes is huge. Obviously its not the most common right now with firepon detonating the entire tier, but once it goes away and more defensively oriented playstyles get better I feel like this'll be super untapped. A pokemon with this much longlevity, spikes and knock off is gross and its a very good way to force progress. I feel like roost/eq/spikes/koff is going to see decent usage, but a tera water sd set with crabhammer and earthquake also seems to have a lot of potential
There's no actual point to Crabhammer. Now you just get walled by grass types even harder and facade is almost as strong as STAB Crabhammer anyways, except you don't have to tera for it. Also it's not even worth using for mons like Skarm, since Gliscor usually just outlasts them anyway.yeah I agree tera is the best generational mechanic if you don't count the other 2 better generational mechanics
also, to stop this from being a oneliner,
I feel like gliscor getting spikes is huge. Obviously its not the most common right now with firepon detonating the entire tier, but once it goes away and more defensively oriented playstyles get better I feel like this'll be super untapped. A pokemon with this much longlevity, spikes and knock off is gross and its a very good way to force progress. I feel like roost/eq/spikes/koff is going to see decent usage, but a tera water sd set with crabhammer and earthquake also seems to have a lot of potential
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Nominating
to B-/B, shout out to Scalescale for showing me those 90%+ GXE teams with the masterpiece on QQ (as well as Nashrock/RimarinaLOVE for giving him alts to ladder with 
).
Shared Scale's teams with setset77 and we feel that the mon is genuinely solid after doing our own testing: its physical bulk and access to CM/STAB shadow ball allows it to run defensive sets without being too passive while strength sap gives it a fairly good form of recovery in a tier filled with physical attackers (also great for harassing teams that spam physical breakers by making everything that switches in start at -1). Its signature move needs no explanation as to why it is good - an 80 BP HP drain move with a 20% chance to burn the opponent is incredible when the only drawback is 10% away from perfect accuracy. Heatproof further improves its already-solid type profile by making it neutral to fire moves, and unlike Heatran that is reliant on leftovers for recovery, Sinistcha can sap switch-ins to stay healthy while using an ability shield to stave off the flames of the hearth (although leftovers is an amazing item for it and is great on teams not weak to the pon). Combined with its resistance/immunity to ground/water/electric/fighting moves without being weak to u-turn, Sinistcha slots in perfectly for teams looking for a sturdy answer to those typings while being a potential lategame threat. Here are some replays of it putting in work:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1953108157-cbgr55ce99ux5vp2augnmmf1p31trpepw (beat Gliscor, Pex while weakening Zamazenta enough for scarf Lele and band Weavile to clean up)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1953134817-329mjl4xhce5updnl992o14ar404qb9pw (kept on forcing Gholdengo in and greatly weakened it with shadow ball on the switch, rendered Ogerpon-Wellspring effectively useless while beating Lopunny-Mega and Excadrill)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1953170557-wal95phipd6zuvgajwwkhvzpj126c88pw (LeCha James performance - beat Scizor-Mega, Great Tusk and SD Sneasler)
).Shared Scale's teams with setset77 and we feel that the mon is genuinely solid after doing our own testing: its physical bulk and access to CM/STAB shadow ball allows it to run defensive sets without being too passive while strength sap gives it a fairly good form of recovery in a tier filled with physical attackers (also great for harassing teams that spam physical breakers by making everything that switches in start at -1). Its signature move needs no explanation as to why it is good - an 80 BP HP drain move with a 20% chance to burn the opponent is incredible when the only drawback is 10% away from perfect accuracy. Heatproof further improves its already-solid type profile by making it neutral to fire moves, and unlike Heatran that is reliant on leftovers for recovery, Sinistcha can sap switch-ins to stay healthy while using an ability shield to stave off the flames of the hearth (although leftovers is an amazing item for it and is great on teams not weak to the pon). Combined with its resistance/immunity to ground/water/electric/fighting moves without being weak to u-turn, Sinistcha slots in perfectly for teams looking for a sturdy answer to those typings while being a potential lategame threat. Here are some replays of it putting in work:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1953108157-cbgr55ce99ux5vp2augnmmf1p31trpepw (beat Gliscor, Pex while weakening Zamazenta enough for scarf Lele and band Weavile to clean up)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1953134817-329mjl4xhce5updnl992o14ar404qb9pw (kept on forcing Gholdengo in and greatly weakened it with shadow ball on the switch, rendered Ogerpon-Wellspring effectively useless while beating Lopunny-Mega and Excadrill)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1953170557-wal95phipd6zuvgajwwkhvzpj126c88pw (LeCha James performance - beat Scizor-Mega, Great Tusk and SD Sneasler)
UR --> CMega Banette has had some serious buffs in gen9 including a much better physical stab in poltergeist going from 70 -> 110bp giving it a much better way to make use of its unreal base 165 attack stat (higher than anything currently in NDOU) and newly gained access to prankster encore allowing you to make hard reads on anything setting up and lock them in.
The best set I feel is:
Banette-Mega @ Banettite
Ability: Frisk
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Poltergeist
- Destiny Bond
- Encore / Knock Off / Gunk Shot
- Swords Dance
although you change it to +spe if using it on webs or max hp no speed if using it on screens. Mono ghost is possibly one of the best types for 1 attack sets possible and its not really held back by that given it can 1 for 1 trade with any ghost switchins.
This mon almost always forces at a minimum a 1 for 1 trade with priority destiny bond now, since if they click any move that isnt an attack you can encore them into it and set up your own swords dances, it also has access to a huge pool of prankster utility moves including wisp, toxic, twave and taunt. Encore allows it to easily get an SD up after just one good read or even just the threat of using destiny bond on a mon thats a crucial wincon to your opponent often forces switches and gives you free turns.
Poltergeist is such a massive damage buff that now it can blow past common defensive mons that would previously wall it such as toxapex, skarmory, ferrothorn, moltres defensive lando, mega scizor and gliscor while also encoring mons that can wall it such as unaware dondozo
+2 252+ Atk Banette-Mega Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 192+ Def Toxapex: 262-309 (86.1 - 101.6%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Banette-Mega Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 268-316 (80.2 - 94.6%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Banette-Mega Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 280-331 (79.5 - 94%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after 1 layer of Spikes
+2 252+ Atk Banette-Mega Poltergeist vs. 248 HP / 252 Def Scizor-Mega: 294-346 (85.7 - 100.8%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Banette-Mega Poltergeist vs. 248 HP / 248+ Def Moltres: 364-430 (95 - 112.2%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Banette-Mega Poltergeist vs. 244 HP / 252+ Def Gliscor: 291-343 (82.6 - 97.4%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Banette-Mega Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Landorus-Therian: 273-322 (71.4 - 84.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (decent chip for a mon with no recovery also lives any attack back from defensive lando)
even breaks through the splashable ghost check garganacl (if it clicks iron defence or curse you just encore lock it in and switch to take advantage or alternatively just taunt it first then click polt twice)
+2 252+ Atk Banette-Mega Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Purifying Salt Garganacl: 189-223 (46.7 - 55.1%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
The biggest threats to mega bannette are actually the three normal types running around the tier right now and any potential dark types that can pursuit trap you.
in the worst case scenario you just have to trade 1 for 1 with them using destiny bond, best case scenario you slowly chip away at mlop with knock or gunk shot which does 66-78% and potentially knock the flame-orb off luna when it switches in, with pursuit trappers you trade with them using destiny bond, which can often free up other mons like lele to go ham.This mon fits perfectly well on a variety of team builds such as webs teams where its mediocre speed is significantly boosted and can now easily ohko threats that would outspeed it without having to use its destiny bond, screens which boosts its mediocre bulk to allow it to break through 2-3 mons before dying or even fat teams where it functions as a utility mon and back stop to opposing setup paired with some slow pivot mon to bring it in against threats clicking setup moves, this goes without even mentioning that its the key piece to gimmicky revival blessing teams (which i personally dont think are great but can definitely mu fish you).
Combined with the fact that mega slots are as free as they ever have been i think mega banette is a mon you should definitely consider as viable to build around.
TL:DR This mon can now blow past most defensive switchins that could previously wall it when it used shadow claw, act as a prediction/switchin reliant hard counter to any non dark type setup mons and at worst trade 1 for 1 with any non priority attacking threats using destiny bond. If youre a good player who can make reads the skill ceiling for this mon is very high and definitely deserves to be called viable.
EDIT: Will have replays with this shortly
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Corviknight to.. D
... this one has been a long time coming. But it just isn't good. It's outclassed in virtually any application just let corv go my God.
... this one has been a long time coming. But it just isn't good. It's outclassed in virtually any application just let corv go my God.
UR-> C-This is the time for gorebyss. gorebyss is that forgotten pokemon "that sucks the Life out of its preys" That bloodthirsty fish/eel has proven itself to my eyes as a worthy Rain abuser. More than worthy, a Rain abuser, the best of its kind. Usable spatk makes it higher than basculegion-f
, the only Other ever seen swift swimmer using spatk. Its movepool is a fish's... Oh WAIT the bro's got psychic to get past pex 
and AM I SEEING THE REAL SHELL SMASH and suddenly bro gets only outsped under Rain by the https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1965659014 This replays shows the total domination of gorebyss undeniably. Also, yes Tier C- cause the bro needs Rain and gets nuked by prios but on the briggt side Ice beam at +2 OHKO multiscale dnite
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-1965714544
That end-game sweep was a proof of the almighty power of the abyssal predator ready to suck out the Life of Even some of the fastest mons in the tier in the presence of zeraora and zamazenta. Its surf move did lotta damages on the defensive clef, obligated to pp Stall till Rain ends. this is an overwhelming presence imo, and bro eelfish is a trustworthy tool on Rain teams Even in mid ladder (1550-1699). That PU/ZU Poké Just ohko'd lando-t, zamazenta the former Uber, zeraora and heatran the OU legend. That was symbolic.
alr some calcs i've been told to dO so
+2 252+ SpA Gorebyss Psychic vs. 248 HP / 48 SpD Toxapex: 280-330 (92.4 - 108.9%) -- 50% chance to OHKO ye pretty neat considering most people still Just run mAX defense
+2 252+ SpA Gorebyss Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Ogerpon-Wellspring: 203-239 (67.4 - 79.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
which is nice since you supposedly outspeed and run sash and the power whip can miss miserably and you play Rain you have zapdos or pelipper hurricane and anyways If not satisfied you can shell smash again
+4 252+ SpA Gorebyss Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Ogerpon-Wellspring: 303-357 (100.6 - 118.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO "yay"
252+ Atk Rillaboom Grassy Glide vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Gorebyss in Grassy Terrain: 240-284 (95.6 - 113.1%) -- 75% chance to OHKO in Other words, 75% focus sash Then win, 25% win UwU
Ah and it breaks through litteraly everything
+2 252+ SpA Tera Water Gorebyss Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Unaware Clodsire in Rain: 428-504 (92.2 - 108.6%) -- 50% chance to OHKO yay so you win any duel nO worries. again, it must be accompanied to take the salt cures or toxics from various mons that can tank. otherwise i would've said B- tier
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Love gorebyss been a secret weapon on my rains since gen8, waterium Z is an absolute nuke to consider running on it too (does like 80-90% to blissey/chansey at +2 in rain iirc and ohkos stuff like tapu fini, mega gyara and toxapex from full and ohkos full spdef ferrothorn after rocks, also makes it more reliable than having to deal with pump misses)
+2 252+ SpA Gorebyss Hydro Vortex (185 BP) vs. 252 HP / 120 SpD Toxapex in Rain: 306-360 (100.6 - 118.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Yeah looking at How often the sash is useful (not so much) waterium z is an option to consider
wynaut omastar?faster stronger bulkier...
The typing of omastar. Omastar's Rock type makes it weak to fighting, ground, double to grass. While gorebyss can shell smash on, for example, an opponent mega swampert or surging strikes locked scarf urshifu, master can't
Viability Rankings
Welcome to the first edition of the Generation 9 National Dex Viability Rankings! In this thread, we as a community, overlooked by a unique council, will attempt to rank every viable Pokemon in various ranks. Please be encouraged to post your thoughts on the viability of Pokemon in this thread!
Ranks
Pokemon will be ranked in descending order; there is no divide in viability inbetween ranks. There is no differentiation in offensive and defensive Pokemon. Toxapex may be A+ for its defensive utility, while Hydreigon may be A+ for its capabilities as a wallbreaker.
VR Council
The VR Council is made up of respected and active users in National Dex. They will have the final say on where Pokemon get ranked. Here is the current VR Council:
S Rank
S
Gholdengo
S-
Iron Valiant
A Rank
A+
Garganacl
Heatran
Landorus-Therian
Lopunny-Mega
Sneasler
A
Ferrothorn
Great Tusk
Tapu Koko
Tapu Lele
Tornadus-Therian
Volcarona
A-
Baxcalibur
Charizard-Mega-Y
Garchomp
Kartana
Samurott-Hisui
Urshifu-RS
Zamazenta
B Rank
B+
Clefable
Diancie-Mega
Enamorus
Medicham-Mega
Pelipper
Rotom-Wash
Scizor-Mega
Skarmory
Swampert-Mega
Tyranitar-Mega
Weavile
Zapdos
B
Barraskewda
Basculegion
Cinderace
Clodsire
Cresselia
Dragonite
Gastrodon
Gyarados-Mega
Hawlucha
Hippowdon
Kyurem
Manaphy
Mawile-Mega
Slowking-Galar
Victini
B-
Buzzwole
Charizard-Mega-X
Greninja
Hatterene
Hydreigon
Iron Hands
Iron Moth
Kommo-o
Latias-Mega
Latios-Mega
Lilligant-Hisui
Magnezone
Moltres
Rillaboom
Serperior
Skeledirge
Slowbro
Tapu Fini
Ting-Lu
C Rank
C
Amoonguss
Arctozolt
Chansey
Corviknight
Dondozo
Excadrill
Floatzel
Garchomp-Mega
Glimmora
Grimmsnarl
Hoopa-Unbound
Mandibuzz
Mew
Muk-Alola
Moltres-Galar
Scream Tail
Slowking
Suicune
Tangrowth
Tapu Bulu
Venusaur-Mega
Guidelines
There are some guidelines to keep in mind before posting here. We want to foster intelligent discussion, not unfounded arguments. Please keep these things in mind:
- Posts like "I think X Pokemon should be in Y Rank" will be deleted; make sure to back your opinion with facts and an actual analysis of the metagame.
- Adding onto the above, I would simply like to point out that, while usage stats may be used to support your argument, they should not be the basis of your argument. Saying something along the lines of "X Pokemon is not used often, so it should drop" or "X Pokemon is used very often, but it isn't ranked very high, it should rise" are not valid arguments.
- You shouldn't merely state the obvious things either. We know that Galarian Darmanitan has access to a very strong STAB Icicle Crash combined with good coverage options. We are far more interested in knowing what meta trends may favor Galarian Darmanitan.
- Replays are mandatory to support a nomination if a Pokemon is Unranked.
- This is not the place for personal attacks. Not everyone agrees on the viability of Pokemon, and that is no reason to attack them. Any posts that do attack users will be swiftly deleted and met with an infraction.
- This is not the thread to talk about suspect tests. One liners also have no place here. Both will be deleted and may be met with an infraction on repeated offense.
10/26/2023 VR Update + State of the VR
VR Council has wrapped up another session of voting and with that we have a new VR update that brings some big changes. Before that, I just want to talk a bit about where the VR is at currently and address a few things on my mind. If you don't care about any of this, you can skip to the bottom.
Ever since we started doing VR updates past the initial "pre-meta" where there were large ban slates and everything was more or less in a state of flux, I've seen a decent number of complaints about where certain mons are positioned in the VR. First of all, I think it's great that we are getting feedback. Even negative feedback is still valuable. However, I want to discuss the challenges associated with National Dex viability ranking a bit. What I love most about National Dex is the freedom and creativity afforded to the player inherent to having a full dex of Pokémon available. As a result, we also deal with an unprecedented number of mons that find some form of viability within the tier.
As of this update, we're totaling 91 mons ranked somewhere in the National Dex VR. I think this is actually less than after the last VR update as lower ranks got cleaned out a bit with this voting slate, but it's still a huge amount of mons nonetheless. With this in mind, it is a pretty difficult ask to expect even the most dedicated National Dex player to have fully formed opinions on every single one of these mons. I personally get experimental with most of my teams and still haven't been able to use everything, especially the low tiers, to a point where I can say I'm fully confident about their level of viability. It is likewise difficult to expect that you will play against every one of these mons in tournament or ladder and gain insight that way. It's possible that members of the council can have drastically different opinions on the same mon through their own experience with it. I trust the competency of every member of the VR Council and their ability to make what they feel is the best decision. I just wanted to take this opportunity to be transparent about what I've been thinking about for some time.
With this update, we're expanding the C rank to include C- and C+ as I think this can give a bit more depth to this increasingly crowded portion of the VR. Some of B and B- have already dropped down here, and I expect more of the same as the meta becomes more streamlined over time. Also included in the last VR doc was a section for notes which I think most of the council wasn't aware of as the doc format had recently changed. Going forward I will encourage members of the council to include any of their thoughts and observations next to their vote if they find it necessary. We had a decent amount of engagement in the notes section with this doc and hopefully more in the next one.
Anyway, here's the actual drops and rises from our most recent voting session.
Code:
New Additions:
Ogerpon-Wellspring: A
Ursaluna-Bloodmoon: A
Alomomola: B+
Ninetales-Alola: B
Ursaluna: B
Greninja-Ash: B-
Ceruledge: C+
Meowscarada: C
Tyranitar: C
Empoleon: C-
Jirachi: C-
Ogerpon: C-
Ogerpon-Cornerstone: C-
Rises:
Baxcalibur: A- -> A+
Tapu-Lele: A -> A+
Zamazenta: A- -> A
Zapdos: B+ -> A
Scizor-Mega: B+ -> A-
Slowking-Galar: B -> A-
Tyranitar-Mega: B+ -> A-
Ting-Lu: B- -> B+
Dondozo: C -> B
Moltres: B- -> B
Glimmora: C -> C+
Drops: (there are a lot lol but some are just C dropping to new C- tier)
Iron Valiant: S- -> A+
Toxapex: A -> A-
Volcarona: A -> A-
Charizard-Mega-Y: A- -> B+
Kartana: A- -> B+
Clefable: B+ -> B
Skarmory: B+ -> B
Basculegion: B -> B-
Cinderace: B -> B-
Cresselia: B -> B-
Enamorus: B+ -> B-
Basculegion-F: B- -> C+
Clodsire: B -> C+
Gastrodon: B -> C+
Hydreigon: B- -> C+
Iron-Moth: B- -> C+
Latios-Mega: B- -> C+
Magnezone: B- -> C+
Serperior: B- -> C+
Skeledirge: B- -> C+
Slowbro: B- -> C+
Buzzwole: B- -> C
Hippowdon: B -> C
Lilligant-Hisui: B- -> C
Corviknight: C -> C-
Garchomp-Mega: C -> C-
Moltres-Galar: C -> C-
Tangrowth: C -> C-
Tapu-Bulu: C -> C-
Venusaur-Mega: C -> C-
Arctozolt: C -> UR
Chansey: C -> UR
Floatzel: C -> UR
Grimmsnarl: C -> UR
Hoopa-Unbound: C -> UR
Mandibuzz: C -> UR
Mew: C -> UR
Muk-Alola: C -> UR
Scream-Tail: C -> UR
Slowking: C -> UR
Suicune: C -> URCorv still not D tier I actually have no idea why you would ever unironically use corv there are better options for literally anything it can do
Yeah i'm broke gorebyss isn't there;-; and corv is Still at least a good counter to everything it resists the hits. some archetypes love it
What archetypes dont have a better option LMFAO
Hoping and praying for the usage stats results for this month, maybe it'll drop to NDUU so it would be UR than D
Honestly I think NDUU is the end goal for Corviknight in Gholdengo meta, if it doesn't drop to D Rank, then it's unlikely usage stats (finally) fall off enough for it to be usable in NDUU.
If Gholdengo goes unbanned, which I have a feeling will be the case, then Corviknight is a deadweight on most teams that carry the former, so at the present, I think it's only hope to be good in a ND tier is to finally drop to where Defog is usable.
Why is above ? Don't they just do the same thing? Also, is it 
(like the transformation) or Greninja-Bond(the one with only stat boosts and no transformation)?
above ? Don't they just do the same thing? Also, is it (like the transformation) or Greninja-Bond(the one with only stat boosts and no transformation)?