Lifestyle physical health/fitness thread

[kaps]

Wow, that was a really good response, thanks!

The information about Myofibrillar and Sarcoplasmic Hypertrophy is particularly interesting, as I've always been under the impression that less reps=more mass while greater reps=more fatburn (and thus smaller looking muscles). I suppose that has a lot to do with weight lifted as well though.

I'll look into the Starting Strength program over the summer. For now I do intend to focus on cardio, as I will be using speed and endurance during ultimate tournaments.

I do however have questions regarding lower body lifts such as squats and dead lifts though. If the day before, I run or bike, obviously exercises that heavily involve my legs, is it a good idea to do things like sqats the next day? I know with upper body weight lifting, you definitely want to rest your muscles as this gives them time to rebuild. Does this same process apply when you do cardio with legs one day and weights with legs the next? I don't want to strain any muscles by working my legs to hard, but at the same time I want to build up strength. Do running and squats both work towards the same goal (ie building lower body muscle) or are they adversarial?

 

[Ninahaza]

speaking of squats, something happened yesterday and i would like to hear some opinions on that whole mess.

I am not really known for posting numbers when it comes to working out, i just never. in fact i think the closest I've ever come to posting numbers is what i am about to link to. The reason for that is i would like you to keep in mind what i am about to link as it heavily relates to what happened yesterday. Link for refrence

Alright so i am someone that has a very "afraid" mentality when it comes to squats. when i squat i never really go deep/ass to grass. I always just slightly break parallel and go a little below, and thats only to make myself feel better about being scared of going all out, balls to the wall, ass to grass squats. At the moment i am working on my goal of hitting 400 lbs on the squat, and if you looked at the link i provided, i am doing very well. My current "BIG" goal is to at least break 1000 lbs on a combination of my deadlift and squat by the end of 2014. i dont really know how realistic a number it is for that time frame, but i would love to ring in the new year of 2015 with a squat of 500 lbs and a deadlift of 600+. And to top it all off, i dont really believe in the "1 rep= my max", so i never really go in and try to obtain my max on any lift. i always try to do at least 3 successful reps before i mentally chalk it in as "my max".

Now here comes the problem. Yesterday, out of curiosity, i decided before even entering the gym that i would take some weight off my squat and do ass to grass squats, just go deep. i figured with not as much weight on the bar, i wont be afraid of not being able to come back up after going as far down as i can. so i did just that. i went to work right after the gym. its a nice leisure walk to work from the gym, but here is were the problems started. i was so sore that making that walk was a pain and a chore, and at work it hurt so bad that i could barely make it through the day. now I've been sore before, but this was just a new level for me. also a couple more things i didn't really expect
1: How much weight i ended up having to take off just to do a successful 5x5 ass to grass set. it was way more weight than i thought i'd need to take off just to go down a few more inches in squats
2: how fast i felt the soreness come in and just the level of soreness in general. i was sore before i was even done, way before the walk to work even.

so as i sit here today contemplating whether i should even go back to the gym today (its chest day), i cant help but to keep asking myself if its really worth it, ass to grass squats that is. so tell me, anyone, should i continue this new squat version i tried yesterday? is there even that much of a difference between stopping at parallel and going ass to grass? or is ass to grass more of an ego thing than anything? because sometimes when i see it that's all i really see, people thinking they are just better. i'm thinking about maybe keeping at it for a couple of weeks, but not make it a permanent transition. I would have to kiss that 500lb squat goal goodbye, which i don't mind doing by the way, as long as its worth it and ass to grass squats are really just that much better and worth it.

I do however have questions regarding lower body lifts such as squats and dead lifts though. If the day before, I run or bike, obviously exercises that heavily involve my legs, is it a good idea to do things like sqats the next day? I know with upper body weight lifting, you definitely want to rest your muscles as this gives them time to rebuild. Does this same process apply when you do cardio with legs one day and weights with legs the next? I don't want to strain any muscles by working my legs to hard, but at the same time I want to build up strength. Do running and squats both work towards the same goal (ie building lower body muscle) or are they adversarial?

the process of rest and recovery is not exclusive to just the upper body or any one part of the body. lower body also needs rest just as much as the upper body does.

i live in a nice neighborhood to bike and run, the design that is. Whenever i bike, i always go up more hills than i should. needles to say, my legs take a pounding and i always make sure there is going to be a full day between that bike session and my next leg day session at the gym. also no one body is the same. throughout the first 2-3 months of weight lifting i found that some parts of my body can handle being pounded two days in a row without the second day being affected too much. and some parts of my body just need that rest. for example, if i do something that gives my triceps a good pounding the day before chest day, my bench is absolute shit along side my usual tricep targeting exercises. so i guess listen to your body? and pick up on how it functions with exercise? some people also recover faster in general than others (and of course, some slower)

 

[Ninahaza]

came across this on my facebook wall today. I found it hysterical and great at the same time as it brought back memories from the good old days growing up.

Edit: If link appears broken

 

[kaps]

came across this on my facebook wall today. I found it hysterical and great at the same time as it brought back memories from the good old days growing up.

It's a broken link for me!

 

[junior]

i have this paranoia where it's like if i don't work out at least once a day i lose a lot of muscle tone. note im not super tank/ripped i'm just toned and so when i have long days and dont get a chance to work out in, say, the last 24 hrs i just feel like all the muscles goes away

is this an irrational and stupid fear? obv if i'm ripped it wouldnt go away overnight but it's likely different for toned/slightly toned people

 

[Bad Ass]

if you're worried about muscle it's really better for you to take 1-2 days off per week to give your muscles a chance to recover and build back up. nothing is going to go away in a night, the only difference you will see is if you are hydrated then you will look less muscular than if you were dehydrated, which isn't any real change.

 

[Nosferalto]

i have this paranoia where it's like if i don't work out at least once a day i lose a lot of muscle tone. note im not super tank/ripped i'm just toned and so when i have long days and dont get a chance to work out in, say, the last 24 hrs i just feel like all the muscles goes away

is this an irrational and stupid fear? obv if i'm ripped it wouldnt go away overnight but it's likely different for toned/slightly toned people

your tone won't go away if you don't workout. for it to go away, you either need to gain fat or lose muscle, which could happen over a period 2-3 weeks (rough approximation).

i love working out but training everyday is a bit taxing on your body. you don't have to workout everyday (especially since you say that you sometimes find yourself busy), but when you do, make it count, i.e., train with more intensity and less frequency.

 

[kaps]

i have this paranoia where it's like if i don't work out at least once a day i lose a lot of muscle tone. note im not super tank/ripped i'm just toned and so when i have long days and dont get a chance to work out in, say, the last 24 hrs i just feel like all the muscles goes away

is this an irrational and stupid fear? obv if i'm ripped it wouldnt go away overnight but it's likely different for toned/slightly toned people

Muscle does not go away from a single day of rest. In fact, it's just the opposite. When you work out, you are breaking down muscle fibers so that your body can rebuild them stronger. If you work out the same muscles every day, all you ever do is break them down over and over. This could cause injury, but it will at least make actually building muscle difficult. Something I've been told (which is up for debate, I suppose) is that rest days are the most important day of your week because those are the days when you actually build the muscle you burned during exercise. By not working out you are doing more than if you try to over-strain yourself

But I know your feeling. I often get really agitated whenever I go more than one day a week without doing some sort of exercise. I literally have to drop and do push ups or something right then and there (as long as it doesn't make anything awkward) in order to make the feeling go away. For me, it's less that I think about losing muscle or not burning enough calories; it's just a strange feeling that compels me to do something. Although I've also always been the fidgety guy in class vibrating his leg and chewing on his pencil, so I suppose it just has to do with basic genetics or metabolism.

 

[Lee]

just went 5 months without training. still get complimented all the time. nothing will change in a day, it's all in your head. there is the slight 'pump' you get following a workout but that probably shouldn't be factored in.

 

[junior]

kaps - yeah I definitely know what you mean! It just feels strange not to work out sometimes it's jsut become a habit to. I've had two long days I didn't get a chance to work out so when I got home last night, it was like 2 am and I still had to work out... I think we're addicted to working out :/

lee - how did you go for 5 months without training at all? that would feel so weird.

but everything all you guys said made sense yeah, thanks for the reassurance :)

 

[DM]

Lee is probably talking about the period where he was injured and couldn't train. I've gone through times like that myself, except I'm sure the difference between him and me is that he continued to eat healthy, whereas once I stop working out, I lose all discipline in my diet as well.

As for my own health these days, I am less than 2 weeks away from my one-year hip checkup. Hopefully when I go, I will be told nothing is wrong and I can ease back into intense physical activity once again. In the meantime, I am a little over 2 weeks away from finishing another P90x cycle and hip notwithstanding I'm in pretty good shape. I can't wait to kick it up a notch in April and really get that beach body I want.

 

[kaps]

Lee is probably talking about the period where he was injured and couldn't train. I've gone through times like that myself, except I'm sure the difference between him and me is that he continued to eat healthy, whereas once I stop working out, I lose all discipline in my diet as well.

As for my own health these days, I am less than 2 weeks away from my one-year hip checkup. Hopefully when I go, I will be told nothing is wrong and I can ease back into intense physical activity once again. In the meantime, I am a little over 2 weeks away from finishing another P90x cycle and hip notwithstanding I'm in pretty good shape. I can't wait to kick it up a notch in April and really get that beach body I want.

Speaking of P90X, do you know anywhere to get it free? That thing's expensive. . .

 

[Nosferalto]

I was doing OHP today and I felt a very sharp pain in my neck after 2 reps. The pain is almost unbearable at the lockout where I lean my head forward. Is the pain due to the way I perform my lockout? I still continued my workout which was probably a stupid idea.

and what should I do now? I'm still in pain and I have zero experience in dealing with injuries.

 

[SqueakyGuy]

Alright so i am someone that has a very "afraid" mentality when it comes to squats. when i squat i never really go deep/ass to grass. I always just slightly break parallel and go a little below, and thats only to make myself feel better about being scared of going all out, balls to the wall, ass to grass squats.

Cut some of the quote for brevity. Sorry it's been 5 days since you asked this question, but here's my reply:

I don't know if you're doing high bar (olympic) squats or low bar squats. If you're doing high bar squats, I've never learned those, so I don't have any info for you.

rant about low bar squats, irrelevant to you probably

(Keep in mind I've gotten into Starting Strength, so most of this information is distilled from the materials and philosophy advocated there)

If you're doing low bar back squats ala starting strength, I can offer some advice. In this case, the point of going just below parallel is to lengthen the hams, glutes, and groin muscles to their maximum length in order to provide a stretch reflex to bounce out of the hole. If your hips are just below parallel (with your knees tracking 30 degrees out from straight forward when viewed from above), keeping your muscles tense allows your hips to do a little "bounce" from the fully lengthened muscles in order to drive the weight out of the hole. The stretch reflex and ensuing hip drive is an important element of being able to get out of the hole without fear.

The reason low bar squatters do not do ATG squats is because this requires the relaxing of muscle fibers which benefit from otherwise stored elastic energy. If your hips and knees were set in appropriate positions for a low bar squat, the only way to drop your hips significantly further than parallel is to slack the hamstrings, allow your knees to fall forward so your ass can close the gap to your ankles. This places a significant amount of stress on your knees and removes much of the contributing muscle mass (hams, groin, and glutes) at the weakest position of the movement (the hole), causing two problems: greater risk of knee pain and injury, as well as less total weight can be used, contributing to decreased systemic stress and training factors. Additionally, relaxing some muscle groups often leads to relaxing of the most important muscles: erector spinae. It is hard to go very deep in the squat without relaxing your lower back, which is just asking for low back pain.

ATG may be vital for fragile egos, however, if you're into training for the long haul, I'd stick with just below parallel squats.

EDIT: I looked back at your bar position. Looks like you're doing high bar, so here's some crap I thought about for a few minutes:

High bar squats may translate better to ATG squats because they're performed with a more vertical back angle/less hip recruitment. Still be careful to keep the low back tight during the movement. You would use less weight of course, but you can still get stronger in the movement (look up Milko Tokola brutal back squat training, he seemed to literally bounce his ass off his ankles). I just don't think it's as beneficial as just below parallel squats for my purposes. It looks so scary how much torque must be hitting that guys knee ligaments by literally exhausting the knee joint's range of motion

and what should I do now? I'm still in pain and I have zero experience in dealing with injuries.

Re-evaluate how your neck feels during the next few days. If you're just sore and tight, warm up fully with lots of stretching (everything's connected, so do neck stretches, shoulder stretches, upper back, chest, everything involved in the pressing movement), and consider doing the next few press workouts with higher volume and lower weight.

If the movement still hurts at lockout alone, you will probably need to adjust your form.

If the neck remains "injured" rather than just tweaked, look into Starr's rehab protocol.

 

[ToF]

@ ninahaza - this is more of a question so don't take this as an insult, but are you squatting with proper form? cause i do that weight and it's not a cakewalk...

pain might be because your form is being corrected now that you're going ass to grass. proper squat tbh should be just below parallel so you get the full range of motion but never with your ass literally about to hit the ground. make sure your stance is right too - shoulder width apart, and the pressure's on the heel rather than the tips of your feet. make sure when you go up that its your quads doing the lifting and not your shoulders / feet

 

[Ninahaza]

No worries ToF, questioning form should never be taken as an insult. no matter how experienced you are, bad form is always a possibility. Now to answer your question, i cant say with certainty that its not my form. I think i have good form when squatting, i honestly doubt its my form, but i'll ask a friend to observe and tell me what he thinks the next time i'm in for leg day.

also yes, that much weight is definitely no cakewalk. in that picture i was talking more for the sake of playing it off all cool like, but trust me its hard as fuck and i do get a bit nervous every time i get under that bar with that much weight on it. in fact that's probably the biggest reason for the "fear" mentality i mentioned in my previous post. a fear that i wont be able to come back up if i go too low no matter how strong i am.

and lastly, thanks for the responses

 

[DM]

Speaking of P90X, do you know anywhere to get it free? That thing's expensive. . .

#1. I am a Beachbody coach, meaning I make commission for selling P90x. No, I will not tell you where to get it for free.
#2. This is the internet. If it isn't your first day on it, you should already know the answer to your own question.

 

[kaps]

#1. I am a Beachbody coach, meaning I make commission for selling P90x. No, I will not tell you where to get it for free.
#2. This is the internet. If it isn't your first day on it, you should already know the answer to your own question.

I was hoping there was an option a bit less frowned upon, but alas it looks like its either buy, 'acquire', or not do. we'll see

 

[Heepo]

It's been about 2 months since I first posted in this thread and I just wanted to check in!
First, thank you Delta for such an informative post when I asked about how to start. That was my biggest worry before getting into it, and your post made the first day at the gym much more comfortable than it would have been otherwise.

I've been following the Starting Strength workout alternating with cardio and I've noticed such a difference in everyday life just from that. I sleep better, I stay energized throughout the day, I'm all around happier. I honestly don't know why I never started this sooner. A good friend of mine joined me shortly after I started and it's been great for him as well.
I suppose I had a misconception that extra pounds I was packing would be shed off by now. Certainly my waist has gone down a size, but realizing that I wasn't losing weight because I was actually gaining muscle was a good feeling.
Anyhow, I've started keeping track of my workouts daily, like which exercises I'm doing/weight level/reps/sets blah blah. Now it'll be easier to track progress than just "well I feel stronger." It's also barely warming up around these parts which means the mountain climbing/biking season is about to start, whoo! :D

Also had some questions about more advanced workouts. I've checked around online and gotten too many results to sort through which would be best. Any advice on upgrading from the starting strength workout, guys?

 

[Krul]

Starting Strength can last you a LOT longer than two months. Actually, by right, the first 4 weeks are just warm ups. It's worth doing SS until you have to deload 3 times from an exercise (I'm sure you know, but just in case: if you can't do a weight, try again next workout. If you miss it three times, take 10-15% off the weight, focus on form and work your way back up. 3 deloads and you might have exhausted it.)

What numbers are you at right now? Keeping a log is an amazing tool, always keep a log, whether a book or on your phone.

Basically, I highly advise against changing too quickly. If you're new to weight training, SS can take you so much further than you think. To compensate for a few body parts it lacks, throw in some assisstance exercises (which I think are in the book anyway), 3x8 Barbell curls, dips, maybe rear delt flies? SS tends to ignore these areas, or rather not emphasise them enough imo.

However, if you do choose to move on, programs such as Madcows 5x5 are a great intermediate routine. The reason I suggest to stay on SS is that different routines may only see strength gains once a week, whereas SS builds strength every workout. You can see why you should stay on it as long as possible in that light.

 

[Stylish Interval]

might want to post your stats before anyone recommends you on to another program though, 2 months doesn't sound like you're at intermediate lifts

imo though, texas method is the best follow up to ss (it's like the same program but geared toward weekly gains to give you a brief on it)

i went 5/3/1 after ss (not something i really recommend, 5/3/1 was very good and my favorite program [ive done ss / sl / gslp / a bodybuilding split / texas method all in varying lengths] but i coulda gotten more by going to a weekly gains rather than monthly (or wavely, i guess)) but i quit lifting a while ago so i'm not one to talk too much about lifting anymore now that i've been outta the game for a bit

 

[Razza]

Something I was thinking about was the science behind muscle building, a lot of people tend to say that it involves damaging the muscle fibres, which then repair themselves. I find this a rather dissatisfying explanation and was wondering if anyone here has knowledge of what really goes on in the hypertrophy of skeletal muscle, im thinking as in the role of growth factors and anabolic hormones and how they influence protein synthesis, where should I look for such an in depth explanation?

It seems to me that people are too worried about what program they are on, and what exercises they are doing and with what form, I think that maybe understanding what is really going on in your body to cause muscle growth would be much more useful knowledge

 

[omgocd]

I ran another marathon yesterday, finished in 2:48:20. I was around 2:02 at the 20 mile mark so yeah I hit the wall pretty bad. Still I'm pretty happy with my time and I placed pretty well (12th out of ~1500 males).

 

[Lee]

good effort, i know some really great runners who struggle to go sub-3 and you did it comfortably. Colour me impressed.

 

[Lee]

gym i'm using atm only has a smith machine, no olympic bars etc. are there any drawbacks to using the smith for squats?