But why run this over SDef Excadrill, which also has the utility of Rapid Spin? It's a neat idea, but Excadrill compresses the roles of electric check and hazard control into one slot.*enters sales pitch mode*
*ahem*
Do you fancy a change of pace, but find that Tapu Koko is getting you down? Are you sick of all of those Genesect and Pheromosa spamming U-turn un-punished? Well have no fear, because I have just the Pokémon for you!
Stunfisk @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Static
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Discharge
- Earth Power
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock
All jokes aside, this thing is a super interesting Pokémon to use at the moment, and if you remember me from last gen this was one of my favorite things to mess around with on offense. In addition to being a Ground-type that isn't threatened by any of Dazzling Gleam, HP Ice or Grass Knot from Tapu Koko, it has a number of traits that allow it to actually put in a reasonable amount of work on offensive builds. Static allows it punish people who are getting trigger-happy with U-turn in your face, and in conjunction with the crisp 16.7% recoil that Rocky Helmet induces it can put a large amount of passive pressure onto its opponent. It is good for role compression if it carries Stealth Rock, and most of its switch-ins (namely Lando-T, Zygarde, Lati@s etc.) either get fucked by Discharge paralysis or hate being toxic'd (unless it's smth like DD+Lum Zygarde or SD+RP+Lum Lando, in which case you have to play the 50:50 between Thousand Arrows/EQ vs. switch and DD/SD/RP vs. Toxic, assuming you catch it on the switch and force them to eat their Lum berry). That said, it is still a super niche/team-specific pick for a number of reasons, and as such I can’t really say that it is necessarily better or worse than it was in gen 6. It has a very hard time with ground-types, to the point where toxic is pretty much mandatory on it to catch them (although I guess you could use Scald too if you’re desperate, but it’s just not consistent enough). The loss of Talonflame is a massive downer, as one of the coolest things it had going for it was the ability to not only make Talonflame impale itself on its helmet but also threaten it with Static or, if that failed, put a timer on it with Toxic. The rise of Zygarde hurts it because both DD+Lum and Sub+Coil shut it down if they come in on anything other than Toxic, and there is a lot of water and ice coverage running around too which doesn’t exactly help it much. It’s still worth considering if you’re struggling with certain things though.
More specially defensive spreads can also be used if you want to check stuff like Xurkitree or Alolan Raichu better, so yeah just mess around with EVs if you want and see what works. For example, 252 HP / 192 Def / 64 SpD calm maximises it’s overall bulk while hitting a SpD jump point in the process.252 SpA Tapu Koko Dazzling Gleam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Stunfisk: 79-94 (18.7 - 22.2%) -- possible 5HKO
252+ Atk Pheromosa U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 106-126 (25.1 - 29.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
+1 252 Atk Genesect U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 130-154 (30.8 - 36.4%) -- 59.8% chance to 3HKO
+1 252+ Atk Genesect U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 144-169 (34.1 - 40%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Genesect U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 130-154 (30.8 - 36.4%) -- 59.8% chance to 3HKO
4 SpA Genesect Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Stunfisk: 154-182 (36.4 - 43.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Xurkitree Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Stunfisk: 164-194 (38.8 - 45.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 252 SpA Xurkitree Grass Knot (40 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Stunfisk: 164-194 (38.8 - 45.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Thundurus Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Stunfisk: 130-154 (30.8 - 36.4%) -- 60.3% chance to 3HKO
0 SpA Zapdos Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Stunfisk: 106-126 (25.1 - 29.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 178-211 (42.1 - 50%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 195-231 (46.2 - 54.7%) -- 59% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Alolan Raichu Surf vs. 252 HP / 64+ SpD Stunfisk in Rain: 170-200 (40.2 - 47.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+3 252 SpA Xurkitree Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 64+ SpD Stunfisk: 348-410 (82.4 - 97.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
4 SpA Genesect Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 64+ SpD Stunfisk: 132-156 (31.2 - 36.9%) -- 75.4% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Genesect Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 64+ SpD Stunfisk: 160-190 (37.9 - 45%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 4 SpA Genesect Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 64+ SpD Stunfisk: 196-232 (46.4 - 54.9%) -- 65.2% chance to 2HKO
because switching excadrill into Pheromosa is too real?
Laddering on Sun Moon Bank OU
Because who isn't a fan of getting paras you don't deserve?
Serp isn't weak, it just has no coverage to actually hit targets. Dragon Pulse hits a few dragons, but from there you need HP Fire/Ground to kill something. Aegi would be considered "weak" as well if it only god Shadow Ball and like Dark Pulse (iffy comparison bc Aegi's main set is SubToxic but shhh)
superpower still isn't a thing:
That's a reoccurring issue (the matchup issue). It sorted itself out pretty well in gen6 without the need to resort to too much banning for the sake of threat reduction (although a ban usually lowers the number of threats ). It's very, very early to expect stability. It's a nice time to test weird things, though.
Aegislash - 120 x 438 = 52.560
If I were to take a guess, it's because the higher-ups are seeing how this meta would adapt to those threats to see if they can be left in. I feel like we all want as many options to build with as possible, as long as things aren't stale/repetitive. So, I think what's happening is that they're gauging if Phero-Aegi-Lando can be addressed without being centralizing. There are certainly lots of options to address them, but you're right in that the problem often boils down to them being the best checks for each other and are thus the default. I think bans will come down within the next week or two, but I can understand why it might be slow-going as more options and ideas are developed, tested, and debated.
Cause for all we know, aegislash might not be on 70% of teams if phero is gone, phero might not be on 70% of teams if hoopa is gone, it really boils down to who is more broken of this rock paper scissors core and whether or not we can remove one and let the others settle down in the meta.
Honestly just wanna comment on the part about tapu bulu from your Keldeo set. Yes you can stunt by toxicing but if anything you are really just helping it when it basically came in for free and heal the damage up with ease due to grassy terrain and it's ready to fire off a banded wood hammer or whatever strong move it has on deck. In this case I would still scald it to fish for a burn to make it less of a threat then it already is, to me it just sounds like a better plan. However I do like the creativity in this set for mantine and latis as it would help parts like charY a lot in this meta, also it can hit those random shedninjas on stall teams to get rid of a nuisance Pokémon early. I really admire your set, good job.Guess I'll share some sets:
Zygarde @ Leftovers
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 224 HP / 12 Def / 252 SpD / 20 Spe
Careful Nature
- Substitute
- Coil
- Thousand Arrows
- Toxic
P2 already mentioned some pokemon that have a great matchup vs. stall (Tapu Lele, Z Manaphy, Hoopa-U) and while Zygarde does not have the raw power of these pokemon, it also has a great matchup vs stall because it's really difficult to kill with weak attackers relying on status. I don't like Resttalk because the set can't break Unaware and Sleep Talk rolls can really fuck it over. 50% Zygarde doesn't have the bulk 100% does, but it is still able to set up against almost every defensive pokemon that doesn't have a super effective coverage move (which is rare on stall). It's also decent against bulky offense, but because bulky offensive teams actually use super effective coverage, Zygarde is more of a SubToxic staller than a bulky Coil sweeper against those teams.
Alternate EV spread is 60 Speed to outspeed Bisharp, Breloom and Max Speed Aegi but they are not really common and Bisharp probably will Sucker Punch you anyways.Chansey Seismic Toss vs. 224 HP Zygarde: 100-100 (24.2 - 24.2%) -- guaranteed 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 Atk Sableye-Mega Foul Play vs. 224 HP / 12 Def Zygarde: 87-103 (21 - 24.9%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Rotom-Wash Hydro Pump vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde: 93-109 (22.5 - 26.3%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Slowbro-Mega Scald vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde: 81-96 (19.6 - 23.2%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Venusaur-Mega Giga Drain vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde: 72-85 (17.4 - 20.5%) -- possible 7HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 Atk Celesteela Heavy Slam (80 BP) vs. 224 HP / 12 Def Zygarde: 73-87 (17.6 - 21%) -- possible 7HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Heatran Earth Power vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde: 73-87 (17.6 - 21%) -- possible 7HKO after Leftovers recovery252 SpA Choice Specs Hoopa-Unbound Dark Pulse vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde: 178-211 (43 - 51%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Thick Club Marowak-Alola Shadow Bone vs. 224 HP / 12 Def Zygarde: 186-219 (45 - 53%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde: 187-220 (45.2 - 53.2%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Hidden Power Ice vs. 224 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde: 203-244 (49.1 - 59%) -- 66.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Taunt
- Toxic
I loved to use Taunt Keldeo in ORAS and while Keldeo's viability really dropped in the early stages of SM, I still wanted to use the set. Taunt CM Keldeo is still a nice lure against some balanced teams to lure in pokemon like Toxapex, but the burn nerf and the introduction of pokemon like Mantine really hurt the viability of that set. Some people might say pokemon like Roost Mantine and Toxapex can be lured with Specs HP Electric and while that's true, many players will pivot in another wall first to scout for HP Electric, so it's not as effective as it may seem. Toxic on the other hand does a great job at luring in pokemon such as Lati@s, Mantine (even after the pivot), Tangrowth and Tapu Bulu, while Taunt shuts down recovery from Lati@s, Mantine, Toxapex, and Mega Venusaur and other support moves like Celesteela's Seed+Protect and Defog from Lati@s, Mantine and Tapu Fini. Many people are too busy preparing for Aegislash, Pheromosa and Tapu Koko, so Keldeo can really catch them off guard (not only this set but also Specs with HP Electric).
I too wouldn't mind seeing those guys banned, but we do have a reputation for knee-jerk bans. Other sites are already laughing about how Smogon is already preparing to ban Pokemon that have only existed for a week. I think we could bare to give Aegis and co a couple of weeks before giving up on them. They might just be on every team because old habits die hard, and Aegis had a scary reputation last gen so we are just copying what we knew from last time.
Let me tell you, as someone who spent a dumb amount of hours during the early XY days. Mega Lucario is utterly unstoppable and unpredictable. Genesect, while very adept is not that hard to predict, check or even counter. Genesect's broken-ness has always been caused by U-turn, as even though you know its merely threatening its coverage moves and it's going to u-turn, you simply can not take that risk, and when you switch, it gets momentum. Even the lure and sweeper sets that lack U-turn, the threat of it is so great it gives Genesect inordinate leverage. Despite all of this no one really struggles to check Gene, its usually choice locked, and if its not it's slow (life orb +1 E-speed is OP too, but still one has access to some quick rock, steel and ghost types), and there are always counters depending on which moves it lacks.
They dropped things removed by suspect, the mega stones were quickbanned, also Mega Gengar would 100% still be super broken
