Ununhexium
I closed my eyes and I slipped away...
FREE VICTINI
So this post isn't useless don't use 3 attacks Venomoth
So this post isn't useless don't use 3 attacks Venomoth
Oh sorry, usually in other tier they are allowing to talk about suspects after tier shifts.From the OP: "Rules for posting about suspects are the same here as the last one: don't."
Something interesting is that Venomoth can take on Blissey if it hasn't put anything else to sleep yet and stealth rocks are up. Say they are facing each other and have both taken SR damage.Venomoth also struggles with Stall, as it has no way of getting past things like Blissey, which can just Paralyze it and whittle it down.
You do realize that Scolipede was actually banned on its offensive merits as well right? I am not sure if you were here during its time of release, when it was playing alongside everything as a free for all when ORAS was released. But its certainly no slouch offensively for the tier and easily sets up kills, BP was just the tip of the iceberg. Bear in mind this is UU the offensive presence is vastly different from OU.Ok seriously can we now retest Scolipede back in the tier? It lost one of it's key selling points of being an amazing BP abuser. Ik it can effectively setup on it's own, but I think if we brought back Venomoth who can do the same, we should at least retest Scolipede...
Um. Sleep clause.Something interesting is that Venomoth can take on Blissey if it hasn't put anything else to sleep yet and stealth rocks are up. Say they are facing each other and have both taken SR damage.
Turn 1: Venomoth puts Blissey to sleep, Blissey gains leftover recovery.
Turn 2: Blissey switches to a friend while Venomoth sets up
Turn 3: Venomoth uses sleep powder; friend falls asleep
Turn 4: Venomoth uses sludge bomb; Blissey switches back in and takes SR damage but gets leftover recovery.
+1 232+ SpA Life Orb Venomoth Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey: 187-220 (26.1 - 30.8%)
Blissey should now be at around 55-60; suddenly it's being forced to play a lot more defensively than it's used to against special attackers due to the threat of normal poison. If it get's poisoned its health will be at 43-48. Even if it paralyzes Venomoth to stop its sweep, and not all Blisseys run thunder wave, it will be hardpressed to effectively wall it when it is forced to recover off it's damage while Venomoth can set up further. Also of note is that Venomoth can run Giga Drain which at +1 and with black sludge has rolls of 103, 104, 105, 107, 108, 109, 110, 112, 113, 114, 116, 117, 118, 120, 121, 122, meaning seismic toss will take a long time to wear down Venomoth.
Yes, this is situational, but the bigger advantage is that it will have an effect on the player, who will see Blissey actually having a hard time with Venomoth and may start trying to use other pokemon to beat it, which is exactly what Venomoth wants.
Smeargle was banned because it was an incredible Baton Pass user as it could pass either Geomancy or Quiver Dance boosts fairly easily.Here are my thoughts:
Smeargle: I thought this thing was banned because of its insane movepool. How did a single Baton Pass nerf drop it down to UU? Anyways, it's probably still going to do well in UU because of dat movepool.
Venomoth: This thing's main use was to pass Quiver Dances, so I don't think it'll be viable without it. He even dropped to RU.
Gothitelle: Completely useless without Shadow Tag. Let it drop.
But with dat movepool, Smeargle should have other uses. Sweeper and wall are out, but there must be more it can do...Smeargle was banned because it was an incredible Baton Pass user as it could pass either Geomancy or Quiver Dance boosts fairly easily.
Venomoth, though it was mostly effective because it could Baton Pass Quiver Dance boosts, it makes a fairly effective sweeper with access to Sleep Powder, Quiver Dance, and Tinted Lens, which allows it to smash what would otherwise be good checks thanks to their resistances.
You're right that Gothitelle is useless though
Grass does suck.hello, this is a call to the UU tier leaders to do something about Mega Swampert
as all UU players far and wide know, Mega Swampert is incredibly broken. it is impossible to 2hko because it is only weak to grass, and grass SUCKS, and it 2hkos the entire tier because only grass resists its dual stab, and grass SUCKS. even grass types can't even ohko this thing. i think these calcs speak for themselves
252+ SpA Choice Specs Roserade Leaf Storm vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Swampert: 60-72 (16.3 - 19.6%) -- possible 6HKO
0 SpA Mega Venusaur Giga Drain vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Swampert: 264-312 (65.3 - 77.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
36 Atk Ferroseed Bullet Seed (3 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Swampert: 12-36 (3.5 - 10.5%) -- possibly the worst move ever
and if this wasn't bad enough, look at these offensive calcs:
252+ Atk Mega Swampert Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Porygon2: 84-99 (22.4 - 26.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after it flinches four times in a row
252+ Atk Mega Swampert Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cresselia: 102-121 (22.9 - 27.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after it flinches four times in a row and Leftovers recovery
the two most behemoth physical walls in the UU tier are OHKO'd by this thing without rain
if nothing is done about this monster, I will be forced to ban Sam and Hikari from smogon.com
thank you for your time
"Maybe if Baton Pass gets banned/looked at in OU then we /might/ revisit Scolipede but for now, this bug is way too good for the UU metagame :]" Calloflochie's voteYou do realize that Scolipede was actually banned on its offensive merits as well right? I am not sure if you were here during its time of release, when it was playing alongside everything as a free for all when ORAS was released. But its certainly no slouch offensively for the tier and easily sets up kills, BP was just the tip of the iceberg. Bear in mind this is UU the offensive presence is vastly different from OU.
It sweeps with ease in UU, this was seen first hand, it didn't need to really BP for most part. You can't really compare the two it has speed boost + immediate offensive presence + coverage.
Scolipede is broken because it naturally gains speed every turn, has access to way better coverage aka eq which kills steal types while bug+poison covers what eq doesnt, has SD and is bulky enough to setup on most the tier, can be a spikes lead that can also pass subs+speed or just speed by itself. Also on venomoth I have seen some really cool sets and techniques from frens, it seems like a good addition to the tier.Ok seriously can we now retest Scolipede back in the tier? It lost one of it's key selling points of being an amazing BP abuser. Ik it can effectively setup on it's own, but I think if we brought back Venomoth who can do the same, we should at least retest Scolipede...
Actually, Venomoth didn't drop to RU, it was RU when UU banned it, effectively banning it there as well. Now that it is unbanned from UU, it is now available to use back in RU because it was never actually banned there.Venomoth: This thing's main use was to pass Quiver Dances, so I don't think it'll be viable without it. He even dropped to RU.
I mean Scolipede could always just use Baton Pass without using other boosting moves like SD or Iron Defense, which was still part of the problem as well. Scoli still has a good amount of versatility even with the nerf (Spikes + Endeavor, SD, all-out attacker) and can easily combine two of the roles into one if it so chooses. It's hard to say if Scoli's versatility would still be too much for the meta unless it gets an actual retest though.The thing is that made Scolipede so powerful was that it couldn't be countered, because it could always just baton pass if its matchup wasnt good. Now, it will have to either switch and lose its boosts or try to beat its opponent. Just off the top of my head I can name some pokemon that can beat it, such as Forretress and Mandibuzz who can also clear away its hazards, Vaporeon, Fletchinder, Mega Aggron, Crobat if Scolipede doesn't carry rock slide and Porygon 2.