Project Metagame Workshop

[PQRDG]

...and now for something completely different.

Repeat After Me ​

Concept: Immediately after using a move, the opponent uses the same move, if possible. Similar to how the ability Dancer uses a Dance move immediately after someone on the field does, now every move used forces the opponent to follow up and do the same thing.

Possible Bans: At the moment all moves currently in the game are "legal", moves will likely be added to the Restricted Moves section below. Obligatory "Koraidon and Miraidon are banned." Moody, probably Trapping Abilities (Arena Trap, Shadow Tag)

Unrepeated Moves: (Edit: these moves will not be repeated by the opponent) Pivot Moves (Volt Switch/U-Turn/Flip Turn), Outrage, Focus Punch, Protection Moves (all moves listed here)

Strategies: (Edited to use the wording in my later post)

A Pokemon uses a move. The opponent will then use the same move. This does not occur when one of the below conditions occurs:

1) The move is on the "do not repeat" list (the Unrepeated Moves listed above)

2) The move has no affect on the target (the Pokemon's typing or ability giving an immunity, or being blocked by an active effect, such as terrain or Magic Bounce)

3) For whatever reason, the move fails (a condition is not met, like First Impression or Steel Roller, for example)

4) The Pokemon who used the move faints before the opponent gets to repeat it (whether this be from recoil or Life Orb damage, or whether this is a self-sacrificing move)

Examples

If a Pokemon has an ability that makes it immune to a type of move that it learns, it can safely use it and reap the benefits of it then being used by the opponent.

In that same vein, being immune to a move you know because of your typing is also good for you.

Want someone to hit you with just the right move to trigger your ability, or do a low amount of damage to improve your damage on a signature move? Pick a low damage move that your opponent can use to your benefit.

Be careful, set-up sweepers! Oricorio could use your dance moves before, but now anyone can too! Maybe boosting moves aren't the safest option to choose!

If you can force your opponent to flinch, they can't follow up and do your move, or theirs if you moved first. Just be careful that they don't flinch you instead!

Certain moves have conditions that would prevent the opponent from following up with the same move. Sucker Punch fails if your opponent moves before you, and First Impression only works during the Pokemon's first turn on the field. If played well, these moves can be used safely without issue.

Be smart with how you use your status conditions and reap the benefits accordingly.

Edited so it doesn't take up half the page, edited again after some more thought went into the concept. Edited a third time because I realized I hadn't considered the existence of Protect.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

...and now for something completely different.

Repeat After Me ​

Concept: Immediately after using a move, the opponent uses the same move, if possible. Similar to how the ability Dancer uses a Dance move immediately after someone on the field does, now every move used forces the opponent to follow up and do the same thing.

Possible Bans: Taunt (unless the game would prevent the target from being under the effect of taunt until after the move is used by both people), Steel Beam, Self-Destruct, Explosion, Misty Explosion, Mind Blown

Strategies: If a Pokemon is immune to the move used on it, it does not repeat the move. Certain Pokemon will have good uses defensively to prevent themselves from retaliating.

If a Pokemon has an ability that makes it immune to a type of move that it learns, it can safely use it and reap the benefits of it then being used by the opponent.

In that same vein, being immune to a move you know because of your typing is also good for you.

Want someone to hit you with just the right move to trigger your ability, or do a low amount of damage to improve your damage on a signature move? Pick a low damage move that your opponent can use to your benefit.

Be careful, set-up sweepers! Oricorio could use your dance moves before, but now anyone can too! Maybe boosting moves aren't the safest option to choose!

Using a move to switch out could force your opponent to do the same! (Though I would be willing to negate this effect on Volt Switch and U-Turn if that seems too OP) Do you want to risk forcing your opponent to teleport if it means they have a chance at getting rid of whoever they have out front?

If you can force your opponent to flinch, they can't follow up and do your move, or theirs if you moved first. Just be careful that they don't flinch you instead!

Any option to keep your opponent from using moves is great. With sleep moves banned, paralysis is going to be the only status that has a change to stop an opponent from making a follow-up attack.

Any way to burn a physical attacker in a way that doesn't hurt you too much in the long run is always good.

Using Toxic is still safe if you are a type immune to being Poisoned, you already have an active status, or you would benefit from poison being thrown back at you.

Abilities still apply as normal, though some abilities may prove to be more effective than others.

U-turn, Flip Turn, and Volt Switch definitely seem banworthy, especially U-turn and Flip Turn. A fast VoltTurn will cancel whatever move the opponent was going to make, like the Prankster Copycat Roar days of yore, and can potentially put on a lot of extra damage with your own Rocky Helmet or Iron Barbs. Volt Switch isn't as strong since it doesn't make contact (yeah you can Volt Switch into a Ground-type but then the opponent's Volt Switch fails and you've just accomplished vanilla Volt Switch) but it's still really obnoxious because it removes all agency from a slower opponent.
EDIT: Oh, and Parting Shot. Teleport is probably fine because of its negative priority.




Curse Dondozo seems very strong. Its Unaware ability means that it doesn't have to worry about giving the opponent Attack and especially Defense boosts, and it has the added bonus of lowering the opponent's Speed. Dondozo itself only benefits from this against slow walls, but an ally special attacker can come in for an easy revenge kill if Dondozo gets KOed. On a similar note, Skeledirge can spam Torch Song and not worry about giving the opponent Special Attack boosts, though against physical attackers that doesn't really matter.

 

[prunyy]

...and now for something completely different.

Repeat After Me ​

Concept: Immediately after using a move, the opponent uses the same move, if possible. Similar to how the ability Dancer uses a Dance move immediately after someone on the field does, now every move used forces the opponent to follow up and do the same thing.

Possible Bans: Taunt (unless the game would prevent the target from being under the effect of taunt until after the move is used by both people), Steel Beam, Self-Destruct, Explosion, Misty Explosion, Mind Blown

Strategies: If a Pokemon is immune to the move used on it, it does not repeat the move. Certain Pokemon will have good uses defensively to prevent themselves from retaliating.

If a Pokemon has an ability that makes it immune to a type of move that it learns, it can safely use it and reap the benefits of it then being used by the opponent.

In that same vein, being immune to a move you know because of your typing is also good for you.

Want someone to hit you with just the right move to trigger your ability, or do a low amount of damage to improve your damage on a signature move? Pick a low damage move that your opponent can use to your benefit.

Be careful, set-up sweepers! Oricorio could use your dance moves before, but now anyone can too! Maybe boosting moves aren't the safest option to choose!

Using a move to switch out could force your opponent to do the same! (Though I would be willing to negate this effect on Volt Switch and U-Turn if that seems too OP) Do you want to risk forcing your opponent to teleport if it means they have a chance at getting rid of whoever they have out front?

If you can force your opponent to flinch, they can't follow up and do your move, or theirs if you moved first. Just be careful that they don't flinch you instead!

Any option to keep your opponent from using moves is great. With sleep moves banned, paralysis is going to be the only status that has a change to stop an opponent from making a follow-up attack.

Any way to burn a physical attacker in a way that doesn't hurt you too much in the long run is always good.

Using Toxic is still safe if you are a type immune to being Poisoned, you already have an active status, or you would benefit from poison being thrown back at you.

Abilities still apply as normal, though some abilities may prove to be more effective than others.

The way I would go about teambuilding would be to self check. It’s kind of a weird version of improofing.

Set-up sweepers are no good cause the opponent does the same thing. Hazards and other status moves in general don’t really work unless your mon can deal with them, Magic Bounce is one way. Something like Unaware Skeledirge spamming Torch Song could be viable as you don’t get affected. You can even proc Guts or Poison Heal, while still having an item as long as you can guarantee the status. You can also click moves you are immune to. You could also do some gimmicks with Weak Armor, Stamina, Justified, and abilities of that sorts. Also Trick Room immediately fails.

Also also, is a thing.

As DrPumpkinz mentioned, VoltTurn moves look ban worthy.

Those are my first look thoughts. It seems quite fun, just not my style tho.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

Using Trick Room is completely impossible, since trying to set Trick Room will result in the opponent immediately undoing Trick Room.



First Impression's and Sucker Punch's fail conditions make them both very effective in this meta. The opponent's First Impression will fail unless it's also their first turn on the field, and the opponent's Sucker Punch will always fail because it doesn't work on Pokemon who have already made their move.



Lurantis can boost its Special Attack while simultaneously lowering the opponent's with Contrary Leaf Storm. Unfortunately it doesn't get Superpower at the moment, so we'll have to wait for Enamorus for that.

 

[Turtlek]

Tool Swap (WIP)
Metagame premise: You can take any ability you want, as long a Pokémon with this ability has your movepool! The purpose is to make something similar to AAA, but with more links between mons. Also to see funny relations between movepools. It would work like inheritance, but you can’t use illegals moves.
Functionement:
Alohomora (Scream Tail) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Play Rough
- Wish
- Protect
- Light Screen
So, all of Scream Tail’s moves are also obtainable on another Pokémon, in this case the one we are interested in is Alomomola. Scream Tail is allowed to take Alomomolas Abilities. It could also take Pixilated, Static, Cute Charm, Competitive, Hydration, Healer and Lighting Rod. Meta would be a lot based on scouting I guess, with a lot of Stall as all stalkers are the same. On the other hand, Mold Breaker could be the path to freedom.

Potential bans and threats: Broken AAA stuff.
Huge/Pure Power are obviously broken, especially Pure Power since its movepool is wide enough. Iron Hands especially can run a classic set.
Iron Hands @ Punching Glove
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Ice Punch
- Thunder Punch
- Close Combat

Poison Heal may be OP, but I doubt it, maybe some would like to run ToxicSubSeed.

Stakeout’s without a doubt broken, Roaring Moon can run a Band set with a normal movepool.

Comatose is probably fine, as Komala hasn’t Rose.

Questions for the community:
Other bannable things? Should inheriting from NDex/Unreleased be allowed?

 

[KaenSoul]

What if, instead of an arbitrary list of Pokemon ("oh no let's hope we didn't forget to update ______ after it was added later in the gen") it worked in a similar fashion to Inheritance? You have to name the Pokemon after a Pokemon that it shares a type with. Then, based on which slot in the party it is in, it gets the appropriate stat from that donor. I'm presuming this would be easier to code than "let's check what the highest defense is on a water type in this list". Your method seems to require checking every single non-banned Pokemon in existence to find the highest stat, or to create a specific database with essentially the chart Kaen created earlier. This alternative just checks the Pokemon you chose, and replaces the single appropriate stat.

Admittedly, I do not know if this version is better or worse. I do however thinks this fixes some of the potential flaws this concept is currently running with.

While this sounds good in theory, using names would be an unnecessary step as you only really have one option for every combination of Slot/Type when it comes to donors, the one with the highest stat, so letting it be automatic is better.
Unless, we add something else, like not just gaining the base stat, but also the movepool or secondary type to not be too much like inheritance.

...and now for something completely different.

Repeat After Me ​

Concept: Immediately after using a move, the opponent uses the same move, if possible. Similar to how the ability Dancer uses a Dance move immediately after someone on the field does, now every move used forces the opponent to follow up and do the same thing.

Possible Bans: Steel Beam, Self-Destruct, Explosion, Misty Explosion, Mind Blown, Maybe Pivot Moves? (U-Turn, Flip Turn, Volt Switch), Maybe Choice Items? (not sure how they would interact with the concept)

Strategies: If a Pokemon is immune to the move used on it, it does not repeat the move. Certain Pokemon will have good uses defensively to prevent themselves from retaliating. Attacking Pokemon can promote a similar strategy to deal with their opponents.

Examples

If a Pokemon has an ability that makes it immune to a type of move that it learns, it can safely use it and reap the benefits of it then being used by the opponent.

In that same vein, being immune to a move you know because of your typing is also good for you.

Want someone to hit you with just the right move to trigger your ability, or do a low amount of damage to improve your damage on a signature move? Pick a low damage move that your opponent can use to your benefit.

Be careful, set-up sweepers! Oricorio could use your dance moves before, but now anyone can too! Maybe boosting moves aren't the safest option to choose!

If you can force your opponent to flinch, they can't follow up and do your move, or theirs if you moved first. Just be careful that they don't flinch you instead!

Any option to keep your opponent from using moves is great. With sleep moves banned, paralysis is going to be the only status that has a change to stop an opponent from making a follow-up attack.

Any way to burn a physical attacker in a way that doesn't hurt you too much in the long run is always good.

Using Toxic is still safe if you are a type immune to being Poisoned, you already have an active status, or you would benefit from poison being thrown back at you.

Abilities still apply as normal, though some abilities may prove to be more effective than others.

Certain moves have conditions that would prevent the opponent from following up with the same move. Sucker Punch fails if your opponent moves before you, and First Impression only works during the Pokemon's first turn on the field. If played well, these moves can be used safely without issue.

Edited so it doesn't take up half the page

I like this idea a lot, but I think you should be consistent with immunities, you don't let Type immunities repeat but then allow ability immunities to repeat, it doesn't really make much sense.
I wonder how it would turn out, will people try to play safe and wait until they have a safe KO before attacking, or will they try to deal damage quickly with moves they resist?
Edit: I think I just got the first example wrong, so forget that.

Oh, have you been thinking about some of the interactions this cause? Like, would using Outrage force you and your opponent into using Outrage twice that turn if you are faster? Would you be locked into it next turn if it was used against you?
How does Encore work here? Would you be forced to struggle because your last move was a copy or would it lock you into your last real move?
If you are under the effects of Torment, and your opponent uses the move you were going to use, will you be locked out of your regular move?

Tool Swap (WIP)
Metagame premise: You can take any ability you want, as long a Pokémon with this ability has your movepool! The purpose is to make something similar to AAA, but with more links between mons. Also to see funny relations between movepools. It would work like inheritance, but you can’t use illegals moves.
Functionement:
Alohomora (Scream Tail) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Play Rough
- Wish
- Protect
- Light Screen
So, all of Scream Tail’s moves are also obtainable on another Pokémon, in this case the one we are interested in is Alomomola. Scream Tail is allowed to take Alomomolas Abilities. It could also take Pixilated, Static, Cute Charm, Competitive, Hydration, Healer and Lighting Rod. Meta would be a lot based on scouting I guess, with a lot of Stall as all stalkers are the same. On the other hand, Mold Breaker could be the path to freedom.

Potential bans and threats: Broken AAA stuff.
Huge/Pure Power are obviously broken, especially Pure Power since its movepool is wide enough. Iron Hands especially can run a classic set.
Iron Hands @ Punching Glove
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Ice Punch
- Thunder Punch
- Close Combat

Poison Heal may be OP, but I doubt it, maybe some would like to run ToxicSubSeed.

Stakeout’s without a doubt broken, Roaring Moon can run a Band set with a normal movepool.

Comatose is probably fine, as Komala hasn’t Rose.

Questions for the community:
Other bannable things? Should inheriting from NDex/Unreleased be allowed?

This feels too much like Inheritance in how it plays, like, it does have some big differences but at the end you are just using a set that would be legal in a different mon. It is not a bad idea, but it could feel too redundant as there are already established tiers where you can get a similar experience.

 

[PQRDG]

Oh, have you been thinking about some of the interactions this cause? Like, would using Outrage force you and your opponent into using Outrage twice that turn if you are faster? Would you be locked into it next turn if it was used against you?
How does Encore work here? Would you be forced to struggle because your last move was a copy or would it lock you into your last real move?
If you are under the effects of Torment, and your opponent uses the move you were going to use, will you be locked out of your regular move?

The Outrage condition would be interesting to investigate, but depending on how the game establishes it, we would be using how Dancer works as a baseline for your other examples. I would need to confirm if Dancer works like this, but, in theory, moves like Taunt, Encore, and Torment, wouldn't impact moves repeated by the opponent. I would need to confirm if that works for the Choice items as well, and if so how the game uses the calculations for that, hence why the possibility of those items being banned.

There are a couple of other examples that I would need to see how they work together, using Dancer as a baseline. For example, in Shared Power, does a Pokemon with Truant and Dancer still get to dance even on the Truant turn? If so, Slaking suddenly becomes viable in this meta because it would be able to retaliate even while loafing around. Moves with recharge turns might be safer to use (Hyper Beam, Giga Impact) if you are still able to return fire during the recharge turn.

Outrage, and any other move that can lock you in to using the same move multiple turns in a row, might have to be banned rather than figuring out how best to code it (I don't think Bide is in this game but that should definitely not be allowed if it exists). Some moves are useless in this context (Skill Swap, Trick Room) though there could be room for making Trick Room a special case to not completely invalidate the strategy (maybe this could be a move that doesn't get copied by the opponent? That could also be a list of moves instead of banning some moves outright).

Edit: I have come up with a solution to the Outrage situation, as well as a better wording to deal with the Explosion "ban" that I have written. The logic would be as follows:

A Pokemon uses a move. The opponent will then use the same move. This does not occur when one of the below conditions occurs:

1) The move is on the "do not repeat" list (this may include moves like Trick Room, as well as the pivot moves Volt Switch, U-Turn, and Flip Turn)

2) The move has no affect on the target (the Pokemon's typing or ability giving an immunity, or being blocked by an active effect, such as terrain or Magic Bounce)

3) For whatever reason, the move fails (a condition is not met, like First Impression or Steel Roller, for example)

4) The Pokemon who used the move faints before the opponent gets to repeat it (whether this be from recoil or Life Orb damage, or whether this is a self-sacrificing move)

Edit 2: 5) The original target Pokemon is no longer on the field (it was knocked out, or forced to switch out via Whirlwind or Roar). This one is fairly self-explanatory but it also helps to ensure that the next Pokemon to switch in wouldn't try to use the move. Mainly a use case for coding to ensure it works as expected. [Hopefully this doesn't result in some moves, like Circle Throw, getting overly used to negate the premise of the meta]

Outrage would be a move that could act as an exception to this logic. Outrage would be a move on the "do not repeat" list. However, while using Outrage, the Pokemon is also unable to repeat any move used by the opponent. This would be a rare condition for this circumstance to apply to, though this may not end up being the only time this exception is used.

I will update the original post to reflect this modification to the rules based on what I have written here. I hope this clears up any of the issues described.

 

[urkerab]

Repeat After Me

I could have sworn someone had a very similar idea called "After You", the major difference being that your opponent gets to use your move first, but sadly I can't find any trace of it...

 

[100%NoobJuice]

I got a idea
it's called Supermons
It has standard OU clauses, but with a big twist
AND Tera is banned in this metagame, it would make every mon broken.
Mons have 1 move. That is the Supermove
The 1st move slot determines the type the move will be, and whether it's physical or special, maybe even status if u really wanted
The 2nd move slot will determine the base power, plus the PP of the move
The 3rd moveslot will determine the accuracy
The 4th moveslot determines the secondary effects when you land the move.
An example set:

Super Grover (Chi-Yu) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Beads of Ruin
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Lava Plume
- Overheat
- Flamethrower
- Nasty Plot

In this case, the supermove is a Special Fire attack with 130 bp, 100% accurate, 8 pp, and it gives +2 spa when you land it.
A potantial watchlist
Any good setup move(eg Nasty Plot, Shift Gear, Bulk Up): Would most likely be banned day 1. A Shell Smash Cloyster set would be insane.
Multihit moves. 100% banned. Dont want a mon like Maushold tearing up the tier with 100% accurate 80bp Dark Physical Population Bombs.
Protect. This would be utter bullshit, ban
Spite. The ultimate PP staller if equipped in the 4th moveslot. probalbly ban
Mean Look. Is essentially a Shadow Tag/Arena Trap but it can actually damage. Ban
Ruination. Ruins all walling in the tier. Ban
There is probably a shitload of dumb sets you could come up with. Also the battle animation is inherited from the first moveslot. When the mon uses it, it says "insert mon used Supermove!"

 

[prunyy]

I got a idea
it's called Supermons
It has standard OU clauses, but with a big twist
AND Tera is banned in this metagame, it would make every mon broken.
Mons have 1 move. That is the Supermove
The 1st move slot determines the type the move will be, and whether it's physical or special, maybe even status if u really wanted
The 2nd move slot will determine the base power, plus the PP of the move
The 3rd moveslot will determine the accuracy
The 4th moveslot determines the secondary effects when you land the move.
An example set:

Super Grover (Chi-Yu) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Beads of Ruin
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Lava Plume
- Overheat
- Flamethrower
- Nasty Plot

In this case, the supermove is a Special Fire attack with 130 bp, 100% accurate, 8 pp, and it gives +2 spa when you land it.
A potantial watchlist
Any good setup move(eg Nasty Plot, Shift Gear, Bulk Up): Would most likely be banned day 1. A Shell Smash Cloyster set would be insane.
Multihit moves. 100% banned. Dont want a mon like Maushold tearing up the tier with 100% accurate 80bp Dark Physical Population Bombs.
Protect. This would be utter bullshit, ban
Spite. The ultimate PP staller if equipped in the 4th moveslot. probalbly ban
Mean Look. Is essentially a Shadow Tag/Arena Trap but it can actually damage. Ban
Ruination. Ruins all walling in the tier. Ban
There is probably a shitload of dumb sets you could come up with. Also the battle animation is inherited from the first moveslot. When the mon uses it, it says "insert mon used Supermove!"

The power level is too huge for any sort of competitive gameplay. There isn’t enough bulk, especially with the advent of Gen 9, that can even survive these moves.
Also making it one move makes it super easy to wall with an immunity.
You would have to make a ton of bans to successfully make this a somewhat competitive OM.

Maybe this supermove should have 1 PP, but you can still use your other moves. Then again these are just superpowered Z moves and don’t really change much from standard OU.

The idea doesn’t feel very well thought out yet. The core concept is cool and interesting, however

 

[urkerab]

I could have sworn someone had a very similar idea called "After You", the major difference being that your opponent gets to use your move first, but sadly I can't find any trace of it...

I had the wrong name - it was called "You First". I have the feeling it got rejected (this was a few years ago now). My original banlist was Explosion, Final Gambit, Healing Wish, Last Resort, Lunar Dance, Memento, Self Destruct and Transform.

 

[100%NoobJuice]

The power level is too huge for any sort of competitive gameplay. There isn’t enough bulk, especially with the advent of Gen 9, that can even survive these moves.
Also making it one move makes it super easy to wall with an immunity.
You would have to make a ton of bans to successfully make this a somewhat competitive OM.

Maybe this supermove should have 1 PP, but you can still use your other moves. Then again these are just superpowered Z moves and don’t really change much from standard OU.

The idea doesn’t feel very well thought out yet. The core concept is cool and interesting, however

100% agree

 

[KaenSoul]

Yay, double posting!
I got a idea called Alt Tera. It is similar to Extra Type.

Terastalizing is changed so that mons that Terastalize, instead of replacing their type, it adds the new typing on top of the pokemon.
Example: A Dondozo Terastalizes into Ground. It now is a Water/Ground type. A Cyclizar Terastalizes into Flying. The Cyclizar is now Dragon/Normal/Flying.
Terastalizing into the same type will give you a +1 SpA and +1 Attack, similar to Growth(to make Tera into same type not completely useless) Im iffy on this one.

A example set could be:

Monke (Annihilape) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Night Slash
- Close Combat
- Rage Fist
- Shadow Claw

This doesn't really sound too interesting, also, you have to wait a week before posting a new idea, take your time to think before posting.

 

[PQRDG]

I had the wrong name - it was called "You First". I have the feeling it got rejected (this was a few years ago now). My original banlist was Explosion, Final Gambit, Healing Wish, Last Resort, Lunar Dance, Memento, Self Destruct and Transform.

Luckily most of those moves should be covered in the Repeat After Me rules now that case #4 says that a move will not be repeated if its use knocked out the user. I had not considered moves like Memento and Healing Wish, but they would in theory be covered by those rulings. I have corrected the example to change the wording from "explosion moves" to "Self-sacrificing moves" to cover the other moves your listed here.

Two of the moves you listed do not fall into that category. Transform I believe is a non-issue now that the target is going second, meaning all it would do is transform back into itself (or maybe fail to Transform at all? Not sure how that interaction works). At the very least, it wouldn't be locking the opponent into being your Transformer.

Last Resort meanwhile is interesting. That is a more unexpected use case. If the coding works properly, it would fail if the user has not used all of their other moves. This could actually be a very interesting strategy for some Pokemon to run in order to have a safe move that their opponent cannot fire back at them. Hopefully this should not be a problem.

I will also note I updated the original post to mention Focus Punch and the Protection moves are added to the no-repeat list. All of those moves would run similar to Outrage, making it so that your opponent does not get stuck with your move, nor would you be able to use their moves while using this. For the Protection moves it would be for the purpose of ensuring you cannot spend a turn being invulnerable but still being able to counter-attack, and for Focus Punch it's to ensure that the move still functions, which could have some strange effects when paired with another attacking move.

 

[Xufactor]

OM: Switch Minimax

Metagame Premise: Players numerically apply the concepts of mixed strategies and risk vs reward.

Players play normally until a turn where one player does more damage, or one player makes a move and the other switches or does nothing (due to taunt or other things). Starting with the player with the "advantage" last turn, this turn he must allocate a percentage chance to each switch he could make, and this is revealed to the opponent. Then the opponent chooses their move. We use a random number from 1 to 100 to determine the first player's move. We alternate who shows their hand every turn. So if it's Player A's turn to show first, and it's his Slowking-Galar against a specs Lele, he might do:

Stay In: 30%
Switch to Ferrothorn: 40%
Switch to Mandibuzz: 30%

 

[KaenSoul]

OM: Switch Minimax

Metagame Premise: Players numerically apply the concepts of mixed strategies and risk vs reward.

Players play normally until a turn where one player does more damage, or one player makes a move and the other switches or does nothing (due to taunt or other things). Starting with the player with the "advantage" last turn, this turn he must allocate a percentage chance to each switch he could make, and this is revealed to the opponent. Then the opponent chooses their move. We use a random number from 1 to 100 to determine the first player's move. We alternate who shows their hand every turn. So if it's Player A's turn to show first, and it's his Slowking-Galar against a specs Lele, he might do:

Stay In: 30%
Switch to Ferrothorn: 40%
Switch to Mandibuzz: 30%

This sounds quite complex for something that is going to not really change the meta at all, as is just OU but with added RNG?

 

[Xufactor]

This sounds quite complex for something that is going to not really change the meta at all, as is just OU but with added RNG?

No.
If it's Player A's turn to show first, and it's his Slowking-Galar against a specs Lele, and he does:
Stay In: 30%
Switch to Mandibuzz: 70%

his opponent only needs to pick between psyshock and moonblast.

If he does
Stay In: 30%
Switch to Ferrothorn: 40%
Switch to Mandibuzz: 30%

the opponent needs to also consider focus blast.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

OM: Switch Minimax

Metagame Premise: Players numerically apply the concepts of mixed strategies and risk vs reward.

Players play normally until a turn where one player does more damage, or one player makes a move and the other switches or does nothing (due to taunt or other things). Starting with the player with the "advantage" last turn, this turn he must allocate a percentage chance to each switch he could make, and this is revealed to the opponent. Then the opponent chooses their move. We use a random number from 1 to 100 to determine the first player's move. We alternate who shows their hand every turn. So if it's Player A's turn to show first, and it's his Slowking-Galar against a specs Lele, he might do:

Stay In: 30%
Switch to Ferrothorn: 40%
Switch to Mandibuzz: 30%

As I and others told you last gen, not only is this not something Showdown is equipped to handle, but the optimal strategy would be to make yourself as unpredictable as possible, turning the whole thing into Emerald's Battle Palace.

 

[Xufactor]

As I and others told you last gen, not only is this not something Showdown is equipped to handle, but the optimal strategy would be to make yourself as unpredictable as possible, turning the whole thing into Emerald's Battle Palace.

Tell me what you think the optimal strategy is.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

Tell me what you think the optimal strategy is.

Set all actions that are very clearly not the play to 0%, and set all other actions to be an equal probability.

 

[Xufactor]

Set all actions that are very clearly not the play to 0%, and set all other actions to be an equal probability.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimax

This is the page on Minimax. If the optimal strategy is to pick a uniformly random play from all viable plays, there wouldn't be all these formulas and analysis on this page.

You fine-tune the percentages based on risk/reward.

 

[Turtlek]

I am stealing an idea from SpiderKoloPL, sorry for not asking

Pocket Moves

The idea behind this new Metagame is very simple:
Each Pokemon have access to normal 4 moves with their normal pp amounts... no tweaks to abilities, just standard OU format for the most part...
And then there is a twist: Each Pokemon have also have access to fifth (5th) move with just a single pp use.

The so called Pocket Move, stored in there just in case for that one special occasion which otherwise would not be used in any normal circumstance.
It would still have to come from Pokemon normal movepool - we are not introducing new moves into Pokemons movepool like in STABmons.

I heard that Pokemon as a game was balanced and designed with each pokemon having only 4 moves in mind and that giving them more would lead to less interesting metagames... And if we were to just allow having five moves with no restrictions attached to it? That might have been the case...

What this metagame is trying to achieve is to answer the question:
Could fifth move with even just a single use break the game?

Every Pokemon have access to their Pocket move of choice (from their movepool) in fifth slot. You have to insert it manually in Import/Export section and at the moment there is no other elegant way of doing that...

I'm not aware of any other similar suggestion from this Thread... But also I was not looking through (at the time of writing) 57 pages filled to the brim with post of other users mixed with feedback.
If there were any ideas like this - I will link those in this post, just please let me know.

Here are few examples of movesets utilizing those new Pocket slots:

Dondozo @ Leftovers
-Waterfall
-Rest
-Curse
-Sleep Talk
-Earthquake
Here, EQ would allow to beat Clodsire in an emergency case

Annihilape @ Leftovers
-Rage Fist
-Drain Punch
-Taunt
-Bulk Up
-Rest
Another emergency button to save a sweep

Hatterenne @ Keftovets
-Calm Mind
-Draining Kiss
-Psyshock
-Mystical Fire
-Healing Wish
This move doesn’t suffer from having 1 PP.
I hope you like the idea for Metagame!

 

[DrPumpkinz]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimax

This is the page on Minimax. If the optimal strategy is to pick a uniformly random play from all viable plays, there wouldn't be all these formulas and analysis on this page.

The difference is that the percentages chosen are revealed to the opponent before the action is actually taken. In effect, setting any action to be favored is telling the opponent "hey, I'm gonna do this", which in a game about predicting what your opponent will do like Pokemon, is a huge misplay.

 

[Xufactor]

The difference is that the percentages chosen are revealed to the opponent before the action is actually taken. In effect, setting any action to be favored is telling the opponent "hey, I'm gonna do this", which in a game about predicting what your opponent will do like Pokemon, is a huge misplay.

You’re supposed to make high reward, low risk plays more of the time. It doesn’t matter if you are more predictable if there is more to gain. The point is to maximize gain, not unpredictability.

 

[prunyy]

I am stealing an idea from SpiderKoloPL, sorry for not asking

Pocket Moves

The idea behind this new Metagame is very simple:
Each Pokemon have access to normal 4 moves with their normal pp amounts... no tweaks to abilities, just standard OU format for the most part...
And then there is a twist: Each Pokemon have also have access to fifth (5th) move with just a single pp use.

The so called Pocket Move, stored in there just in case for that one special occasion which otherwise would not be used in any normal circumstance.
It would still have to come from Pokemon normal movepool - we are not introducing new moves into Pokemons movepool like in STABmons.

I heard that Pokemon as a game was balanced and designed with each pokemon having only 4 moves in mind and that giving them more would lead to less interesting metagames... And if we were to just allow having five moves with no restrictions attached to it? That might have been the case...

What this metagame is trying to achieve is to answer the question:
Could fifth move with even just a single use break the game?

Every Pokemon have access to their Pocket move of choice (from their movepool) in fifth slot. You have to insert it manually in Import/Export section and at the moment there is no other elegant way of doing that...

I'm not aware of any other similar suggestion from this Thread... But also I was not looking through (at the time of writing) 57 pages filled to the brim with post of other users mixed with feedback.
If there were any ideas like this - I will link those in this post, just please let me know.

Here are few examples of movesets utilizing those new Pocket slots:

Dondozo @ Leftovers
-Waterfall
-Rest
-Curse
-Sleep Talk
-Earthquake
Here, EQ would allow to beat Clodsire in an emergency case

Annihilape @ Leftovers
-Rage Fist
-Drain Punch
-Taunt
-Bulk Up
-Rest
Another emergency button to save a sweep

Hatterenne @ Keftovets
-Calm Mind
-Draining Kiss
-Psyshock
-Mystical Fire
-Healing Wish
This move doesn’t suffer from having 1 PP.
I hope you like the idea for Metagame!

This seems like a weird fusion of Broken Record and Sketchmons. I don’t think any of them have been submitted nor approved yet. Try your shot at one of them.